Steve Day Posted May 29, 2008 Report Share Posted May 29, 2008 Hey folks! We were out this past weekend in Big Lagoon (just west of Pensacola Inlet) with the big boat, the Hobie cat, and my Spindrift. We had a great weekend and it was quite uneventful, except for one incident. As usual, there were hundreds of power boats churning up the waters running from one end of the lagoon toward the other and back again. > They give no thought at all to the wakes they are kicking up when they do that. Normally, when we are at anchor with the Beneteau, the wakes are not a problem. However, when we are rigging the Hobie or the Spindrift for sailing, it does get a bit interesting. ;D We thought we had a lull in the wakes when I was de-rigging the Spindrift and I was on the little boat getting ready to take the mast off when a wake hit and I lost my balance. I fell onto the gunwhale just forward of the nesting joint on the port side and started shipping water, so I rolled off the boat and into the water. :-[ I didn't notice it then, but as I got out of the water onto the big boat, I saw the crack in the hull on the Spindrift. We made a couple of final trips to the beach with the motor and hoisted the nesting halves aboard the big boat for the trip home. Here are some pics of the damage taken this morning in the garage. I'm thinking that I will epoxy this back together and then reinforce with fiberglass tape. IMHO this is not a design/construction flaw as the load of a 225+ pound guy hitting the gunwhale in this manner could not have been anticipated as a normal load for the boat. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Nelson CS#35 Posted May 29, 2008 Report Share Posted May 29, 2008 I've been thinking that a lot of you have been using too small of fillets. It appears to me that a larger fillet in the corner may have prevented this failure at the joint. Looks like a lot of people use their popcycle sticks to make fillets. I made sticks out of plywood and made them to the size that Devlin specifies in his book. It takes more material and adds a bit of weight, but remember that we are substituting wood and nails with fillets and fiberglass. I also add 1/4" fiberglass fibers to fillets and glue joints in areas of high stress to add strength. It is like adding fibermesh to concrete. Especailly useful in areas like the transom for powerboats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PinoyPiper Posted May 29, 2008 Report Share Posted May 29, 2008 ouch! did you tape the outside joint? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wkisting Posted May 29, 2008 Report Share Posted May 29, 2008 Well, if I understand the pics correctly, fillet size looks irrelevant in this case. It seems as though the plywood split along/between the plies (delaminated by the force) while the face ply (making contact with the fillet) held firm. The only thing that might've stopped it from cracking this way is tape on the outside of the joint. (I'm assuming it wasn't taped, as it seems strange that a taped joint would split like that... though not impossible.) I agree it's not a design flaw. Hope you weren't bruised too badly, as it looks like you must've hit it hard. But I think your plan of repair will be fine. When you slather epoxy in the gap, be careful not to overclamp it or you might starve the repair. It will be better to leave the ply *slightly* out of fair for the sake of the glue, and then sand the surface back to flat once cured. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Lathrop Posted May 29, 2008 Report Share Posted May 29, 2008 I'm in agreement with Wes. The failure in the plywood is in the center of the vertical grain ply for most of the split length. A better outside fiberglass reinforcement along with a decent knee at the transom/sheer joint would be the best preventive measure. Doesn't Graham call for a knee there? On a second look, I see that this is at the nesting joint and no knee is called for there. If you are going to continue falling on it, you might consider a small corner knee for reinforcement ;D ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Day Posted May 29, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 29, 2008 Gang, It is not my intention to continue to fall on the gunwhale! I hit on my hind parts, so it didn't hurt me (lots of padding back there), but I don't want to do that again. I should have had video of the incident and put it on U-Tube. The outside of the joint was taped, but the force of the impact just ripped the tape. The failure was definitly in the 6mm plywood. From my size and the direction of the impact, I would have been surprised if it had not broken. BTW, the fillet and the tape on the inside of the joint are totally undisturbed. If you note the pictures, the "tear" surfaced outside of the interior tape. I soaked the broken portion in epoxy and have clamped it in place, squeezing out some of the epoxy, but not all. After that cures, I intend to add tape (or cloth) to reinforce the joint. My bet is that you will not be able to tell the repair is there after I get through with it. Ain't life Grand?? Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wkisting Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 As someone who has also, on occasion, broken his boat, I can say there's nothing quite so heart-rending as the first time you seriously damage a boat you built. But then there's nothing quite as satisfying as the feeling you get once you fix it and find out it's almost impossible to tell that the damage was ever done. That's the joy of building your own boat... you learn everything you need to fix it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Jones Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Yep Ray- and that's the exact reason I quit visiting the Wooden Boat forum- too many snobs , many of which never built a boat in their life, but oh do they know how it SHOULD be done. Cleek comes to mind. I don't even have a bookmark for that forum anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Day Posted May 30, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 It's too bad that we keep finding those elitists in every walk of life. They seem to be everywhere. Thanks for the humor, Ray. I think Wes has the right idea. If we build them, we ought to be able to fix them ourselves. I'll keep y'all posted on the progress. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Steve, I took a friend out the first year I had my Vac. I was messing with the main and asked him (a non boater) to keep her headed into the wind. He kept falling off and I kept telling him to point her up. He finally,in desperation asked "HOW" ? Without thinking I said turn the damned wheel! Suddenly realizing what he had done I looked back in time to see him reef the wheel and tear off the port side steering block mount. John felt horrible and apologized over and over for ruining our sailing day. After I checked the damage he couldn't understand why I just laughed. I finally I told him "I built her I can fix her". Down to the cabin for 4" of parachute cord and we were on our way. Sailed all day long and the next weekend too. Good cord, but, the WB crowd will give me a thousand reasons why I had my pax life in my hands and was just lucky I didn't kill him outright. Fix you boat and enjoy!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oyster Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 I have always attempted to tell you guys in a nice way that EPOXY IS CRAP. Being used and depended on can cause potential harm to all life and limb. Now we have real proof that supports this. Glad to see that you were close enough to shore and in warm enough water that you did not suffer any other harm except a bit of mental stress. Now when Graham passes your way on his return trip from the Texas 200, see if he will let you throw the pieces in the cockpit of his boat and haul it away back home since I have a need for worn out skiff for a planter, since my real wood boat is still floating just fine like those 1900 era built genuine boat. ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 A boat will have to fall on us Mike : Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Day Posted May 30, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Mike, The fix has already been accomplished. I have the "tear" epoxied together and reinforcing tape epoxied over both sides of the repair. All that remains is to fair in the tape and put the final finish on it. Pictures will be sent in the next day or so. As to the unintended swim, my only problem was swimming with the jellyfish. Fortunately, they and I did not cross paths while I was in the water. I'll still take the lightweight "Stitch and Glue" construction over traditional. Particularly when we are hoisting the boat aboard to store it on deck. ;D ;D Have a good one, Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oyster Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Mike, The fix has already been accomplished. I have the "tear" epoxied together and reinforcing tape epoxied over both sides of the repair. All that remains is to fair in the tape and put the final finish on it. Pictures will be sent in the next day or so. As to the unintended swim, my only problem was swimming with the jellyfish. Fortunately, they and I did not cross paths while I was in the water. I'll still take the lightweight "Stitch and Glue" construction over traditional. Particularly when we are hoisting the boat aboard to store it on deck. ;D ;D Have a good one, Steve FANTASTIC< Brother!!!! Thanks for patching it up for me. Now I won't have to mess with that old messy epoxy and can launch the boat when it gets here and let you know about the quality of your workmanship the second time around. HEHE!!! ;D ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Luckett Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Steve, glad you were not hurt and the boat damage seems minimal and an easy fix. I am thinking that a small knee might have made a difference, but who knows? I do like to beef up the transom and any bulkheads or any place my large, padded body, might fall or walk on. I often tape joints even when the design does not call for it, or use larger dimensional lumber, especially in what will be hidden areas. I learned that one from my father's boat building experiments back in the 60s. I take it that neither you nor Oyster will be at the 2008 Texas 200 or the Duckwork Mess About? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oyster Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 You know this thread and incident is yet another example of owning your own specially built boat. You break it, you fix it and the fix is rarely noticed unlike gelcoat boats when you patch. With paint, you scuff up the surface, place a new coat of paint on the boat in a couple of hours and you are good to go. With plastic fantastic , you can patch and waz. But within a month or two, you have a deer in the headlights moment when you look at the fix. Greg, I cannot make the Texas 200[sounds like a Mascar event] but also am not aware of the Duckworks event. If its in Texas, maybe I can convince the bride to visit her new grandson and combine the trip. The sorry turn of events lately is that I cannot seem to shake the high fever of the OPEC flu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Luckett Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Mike, Duckwork has a mess about on Matagorda Bay once a year, but I am unsure how long that has been happening. Duckwork is also the sponsor of the Texas 200, and that ends at the beginning of the mess about. Texas 200 Monday to Friday (June 9-13, 2008), then the Duckwork Mess About, Friday to Sunday (June 14-15, 2008). http://www.texas200.com/ http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/calendar/duckworks.htm I cannot get to the Texas 200 but hope to see the folks make it in on the 13th. Needless to say, we are excited to be able to go and the cost of fuel is a terrible expense for us too. We need to visit my parents, the primary reason for the trip, but not the only one. I hope to have a boat ready for next year's event if it continues and am looking forward to hearing of this year's adventures. I will try to take lots of pics etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Jones Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Greg- look here for the post and pics of the test sail http://www.messing-about.com/forums/index.php?topic=6147.0 This will be the 5th year for the Messabout on Magnolia Beach. The one in 2003 was held on North Padre Island, which is kinda hard to get to, so I introduced Chuck and Sandra to Magnolia Beach- they've been back every year since 2004. And it gets bigger every year also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Day Posted June 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 Sorry Guys, I won't be able to make it to either the Texas 200 or the messabout. Too much other stuff going on these days. I wanted to do the BEER cruise in Pensacola, but my boat is chartered. Gina and I are thinking about going over to the "opening" dinner to meet all of the folks, but I'm not too keen on doing the cruise in the Hobie Cat or the Spindrift. Maybe next year! Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Day Posted June 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2008 I have completed the repair on the dinghy and have one coat of finish paint on it. Looks pretty good, if I do say so myself. Pics to follow in a day or so. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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