Terry Dunn

You can do it! I built my CS 20 in a 20' 7" by 18' 10" garage. The panels fit diagonally. Once the boat was stitched it fit lengthwise. My son and I stitched her together, set her on some picnic tables and away we went. I did do most of the cutting on the deck in the backyard. It was December in Colorado. I used a space heater to get the garage warm enough to epoxy. We have sailed three seasons and she hasn't fallen apart so I think it worked.

Jeff, I don't think they need to be much higher. My mast steppers have a 5" base, are 4" tall and the pivot point is 3.5" I think you could go to a 6" base 6" to 9" pivot point with the height .75 taller than the pivot point and get a lot more safety when lifting the masts up. There doesn't seem to be that much strain on the steppers when stepping the masts. I think I will make a taller front stepper and move the front stepper to the reefing position. I have only used the reefing position once. The reefing position worked well but is was more challenging to step the mizzen in the reefing position with the higher winds. Then when I am transporting and storing the boat during the season, I can leave the main mast in the stepper and it will clear the reefing stepper.

Jeff, I have stepped the masts afloat. It could be exciting in rougher water. It is still more secure than nothing. I have considered making a device to assist stepping the mizzen in the reefing position so I could move the mizzen while on the water in higher winds. We have only used the reefing position once, but it was worth it. Since you have a reefing method you don't need anything like that. One downside of my system versus a tabernacle is you still have to lift the masts straight up to the point where they can be lowered. You have to be careful not to lift too far. That is a bad thing. If mine were taller pulling out accidentally would be less likely. Some sort of crutch would be nice to secure the mizzen when it is lowered. The main can rest on a pad on the transom. My devices are screwed on and can be removed. At first I was going to use thru bolts with thumb screws but I found it worked well to leave the main in the device for travel and storage so I never take them off. The tabernacle idea proposed by Ray would be more secure and less weight to lever. Ray, With the mast tubes in place, it does not seem like it would not be that big a deal to retrofit tabernacles. Seems like one could build the supporting frame and slip it into the mast tube. What do you think the effort and pros and cons are?

Here is a post of what I did: http://www.messing-about.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2621&highlight= How much effort it takes to lift the masts depends on what they weigh. I have sleeved sails with no extra weight up top. Works ggod for me.

Please send me one as well Graham. Looks like a good improvement for my CS20.

I determined how big a boat I could build by measuring my garage. It is 20' 7" long and about 18' wide. So I built a CS20. I did most of the sawing on my deck at the back of the house. My boat went 3D sitting on the picnic table benches in the garage. I built a cradle on casters to make it easier to move the boat around. I was able to move the boat to one side of the garage and get my wife's minivan (now known as the tow car) in the garage. Fortunately I am a terrible furniture builder so I was able to devote most of my spare time to the boat. Good luck with your project.

I used three 8' sections ( 3", 2.5", 2") and cut the top off to get the 22' length. My masts are probably more bendy than most with the 8' of 3" on the bottom. Since I don't have another CS 20 in the neighborhood to compare too it seems to work fine. I have standard size sails with sleeves. Graham may have some words of wisdom regarding the 8' lengths. You could connect 2 3" sections with 18" of 2.5" with fiberglass bearings and a narrow collar in the middle.

I bought mast tubing for my CS 20 from online metals in 8' lengths. The price was reasonable and the shipping was cheap via UPS. The service was good. I used .065 all the way. So far it has been fine. Perhaps someday I will break or bend my .065 3" bottom section. This is the third season we have had our CS 20 in the water. We have been out in heavy winds but when we had a bunch of people in the boat the winds have been moderate. So we have not hit the condition of lots of movable ballast and lots of wind. I paid $267.78 on 3/10/2003 including shipping.

Hmmn. I grew up in Washington. Des Moines, Midway area. I miss Puget Sound.

We managed to get our boat on Grand Lake and Lake Dillon in the Colorado mountains this year. We had generally light winds so we used the motor some. Another year and I will have the ten hours specified for the break in period on the motor. We were also paid a visit from Tim Mauser and family (CS 20 #53). We managed a sail on the local reservoir and had some nice wind. Tim can come by any time as long as he brings the wind.

In order to have a place to put the oars when they are not in use and yet have them readily available I hung them under the side decks. The oars are spoon blade spruce 9' long.

The outer pipe is .125"

The plans will tell you the designed sizes. I think the plans call for 10' of 3" .083, 8' of 2.5" .065 and 6' of 2" .065. I did not verify this. I used 8' of 3" .065, 8' of 2.5" .065 and 8' of 2" .065 for each mast. All T6 6061. I also got my tubing from Online metals. I have not had any problems with masts bending. However, after reading the posts from Austrailia, I suspect .125 would have been a better choice for the 3". Online did not have .083 when I ordered. 8' lengths are much cheaper to ship. Enjoy the plans. Do what they say and you get a great boat.

I also went with a jump set aft of the mizzen. Works pretty good for me on my CS 20. My temp seat is a few inches higher than than the side seats. I think the height helps the rowing position. A cushion on the seat makes it more comfortable. I try to get my wife to row as much as possible. Good for her, you know.

The CS 20 is not ballasted so I did not have to mess with lead. There are local suppliers for the aluminum tubing. I got an estimate from one place, don't remember the name. I bought my tubing in 8' sections from online metals. Only $23 shipping UPS. Longer sections can't be sent UPS. I looked at a used 4hp LS two stroke before I bought my 4 stroke. The cloud of smoke when it first started convinced me to go with the 4 stroke. http://onlinemetals.com/ http://www.onlineoutboards.com/#

If you watch the want adds in the Denver papers in the spring there will be a variety of small outboard for sale over a period of time. Some of them are not used much. I bought a new Tohatu 5 hp 4 stroke Long shaft for my CS 20 over the internet. More motor than needed. I went to 5 for full gearshift and the remote tank was included. The only place I have used it other than break in at Cherry Creek was on Lake Superior. I did not really need it there but wanted it just in case. The motor works great but if I had it to do over I would have bought a used 2 stroke for much less money so I could store it any old way without have a potential problem. You are not supposed to stand the 4 stroke on it's head. Just lay it on the tiller side if necessary. With the Princess that is probably not a problem since the motor will probably travel in the motor well. One thing to consider in Colorado is altitude. A gas motor will not have as much power at 9,000 ft as at sea level. Does the P22 take a short shaft or long shaft?

Hello Colorado Builder, You should have a lot of fun building a P22. I built a Core Sound 20 and have sailed it the past two summers. Buying materials to build boats in Colorado can be a pain. For my Core Sound 20 I purchased okoume plywood from Edensaw in Kent Wa. and picked it up at the freight yard in Commerce City. I ordered the plywood over the phone on Monday and had it before the following weekend. Great service. Great product. Good prices. I used doug fir from Home Depot for the rest of the construction materials. After I finished the hull on my CS 20, I ran into a guy that had purchased the old bleacher seats from Denver West High. Mahogany, 14

Ditto what Rob said regarding spray. Jane and I were out in a fresh breeze the other day and took some spray. Worked ok for me though. "Sit here Jane so we don't capsize". I did not get wet at all.

I bought from Edensaw. BS 1088 Okoume 6mm and 3/8" Doug Fir Marine. Packing and shipping was about $200 for the 16 sheets I bought. Good product. Good service. http://edensaw.com/index.htm

I bought my oars. There are a couple of guys in BC that make them. http://barkleysoundoar.com/index.html http://www.lucidstyle.com/islandoars/ They aren't real cheap. I happenned to look on ebay and one of them was selling some 8' oars. I eventually purchased 9' spoon blade laminated spruce oars. I only paid about $135 but I think I got a deal because he had them on hand and was trying to reduce inventory. They were shipped in a tube. either UPS or FEDEX. I don't remember which. I think I bought from islandoars. Can't find the recipt. They work great and are very pretty.

I installed oarlocks further aft and made a removable seat. It works pretty well for me. You have to keep the oarlocks far enough forward to avoid conflict with the tiller. If you are going to do any serious rowing, moving the mizzen would be good as Graham does. I use 9' spoon blade oars. I have made two removable seats. The first one set across the hatch with lips to hold it in place. The second sits on cleats. I have not rowed with the second yet.

I made some devices to assit stepping the masts on my CS20. They are cionstructed from 1/2 and 1/4" plywood and 3" PVC couplers and some 14 - 20 carraige bolts. They are kinda ugly but they make the task of stepping the masts less stressful. I leave the bottom of the mainmast in the device with the mizzen attached to the main while the boat is on the trailer. [attachment over 4 years old deleted by admin]

I decided between a 17 and 20 by measuring my garage. It is a double car garage 20' 7" long. So I built a CS 20. After all, there was 7" to spare. I also had my boat on a dolly so I could push it around. I cut most of my material on my deck and carried it around the house. I could push everything to one side of the garage and get a car with the boat. If I would have considered putting the boat in the garage on a trailer, I may have gone for the 17. I bought a 1987 galvanized trailer for $250. The trailer had a Bayliner 18 on it. 14" wheels. All I had to do was raise the back of the bunks to account for some deadrise and the boat sits on the trailer real well. I figure the trailer weighs about 550 lbs. A little overkill for the weight of the boat but the price was right. I tow the boat with a Chrysler minivan with 130K miles. This summer we drug the thing 3,000 miles on a trip from Denver to the North Shore of Lake Superior, North Dakota and home. About 3,000 miles. Sailed on 4 different lakes. We got lousy gas mileage but the van tows the boat real well. I made some small turnbuckle like things to assist stepping the masts. They are 3" by 5" triangular pieces with 3" PVC couplers between them. I stick the base of the mast in the PVC and raise them up and drop them down. 3" couplers are the right diameter for 3" tubing. I will have to take some pictures of them and post them. They are kind of ugly. But I like them. When it is windy, I feel more secure stepping the masts. It has taken me a while to come up with a name for the boat. I am calling her "Opps!". That is what I said most of the time during construction. I made lots of mistakes. Even so, the boat looks real nice and is a complement magnet everywhere we go. And besides, it does float. Good luck with your project.

Thanks to everybody for the replies. I did not feel comfortable trailering with the motor attached. So far I think there are more con's than the convience provided. Most of the time when I go sailing at one of the local resevoirs, I won't even take the motor. Motors are not allowed. When I take the boat to a mountain lake, I will take the motor. That is a longer trip and I am convinced it is less risky to lay the motor down on it's side. The manufacturer ( Tohatsu) says "If the engine must be laid down be sure the tiller handle faces down ...". hopefully, I will remember that. They have diagrams showing how not to carry or store the motor. That eleminates the way I have carried outboard motors in the past (2 strokes). Mounting the motor on the transom is not a problem once I have it upright behind the boat while the boat is on the trailer ... this would be just prior to launch. Dragging it out of the van etc. will be a pain. A mount at the front of the trailer sounds like a good idea. Do any of you know of one that is manufactured or is it a do-it-yourself deal? Thanks!

I planned to remove the outboard from the boat while trailering. However, 4 stroke outboards are more particular about which way they are layed down. So now, I am considering hanging the motor on the boat to drive to the lake. What are the con's of pulling my boat to the lake with the outboard attached? Should the boat be strong enough for the load? CS 20 Back of boat is 3.5 ft past the trailer bunk. 3/8" plywood on each side of transom for motor pad. Motor weighs abot 60 lbs. Closest lake I plan to visit is 4 miles. Farthest lake I plan to visit is 1254 miles