Staysail Rigging

[ecgossett]

What hardware is used and how do you guys rig the staysail? Do you put it up with the other two or buy its self?

- Edward

[Ray Frechette Jr]

You have a halyard on the forward end of the mizzen mast.

There is an eyestrap on both sides of the boat just aft of the main mastabout a foot back on the outside edge of the deck "Securely"screwed down into the inwhales.

You place a hor cleat under the side decks aft of the mizzen mast about 2-3 feet back that you cleat off the fall of the halyard on the windward side to provide some staying forcees to the mizzen mast.

The clew of the sail has a sheet attached that goes aft to a block attached to the end of the Mizzen sprit boom.

Yep, you sail all three sails at the same time. Graham calls it the Afterburner.

Tack on the windward deck and hoist the sail. Sheet attaches to leeward side of the miizzen mast and you play the mizzen staysail sheet to keep the sail on the good side of collapsing. IE keep the sail full at all times but right on the edge for the best lift. When in doubt, let it out. If it collapses trim it in until it fills.

You have to drop and rehoist for every tack or gybe, and you can only sail about 60 degrees of true with it.

When sailing downwind as you see the main getting starved you want to gybe the main onto the windward side and let run forward of the beam to prevent it from sailing by lee and gybving on you and hoist staysail cleated off of windward deck flying to leeward.

Watch people suffer from sail envy as you pass them by.

As a general rule I tell clients who have not sailed a cat ketch to wait a whiel for staysail. Get comfortable with sailing the cat ketch and then add a staysail to your bag of tricks.

[ecgossett]

You have a halyard on the forward end of the mizzen mast.

There is an eyestrap on both sides of the boat just aft of the main mastabout a foot back on the outside edge of the deck "Securely"screwed down into the inwhales.

You place a hor cleat under the side decks aft of the mizzen mast about 2-3 feet back that you cleat off the fall of the halyard on the windward side to provide some staying forcees to the mizzen mast.

The clew of the sail has a sheet attached that goes aft to a block attached to the end of the Mizzen sprit boom.

Yep, you sail all three sails at the same time. Graham calls it the Afterburner.

Tack on the windward deck and hoist the sail. Sheet attaches to leeward side of the miizzen mast and you play the mizzen staysail sheet to keep the sail on the good side of collapsing. IE keep the sail full at all times but right on the edge for the best lift. When in doubt, let it out. If it collapses trim it in until it fills.

You have to drop and rehoist for every tack or gybe, and you can only sail about 60 degrees of true with it.

When sailing downwind as you see the main getting starved you want to gybe the main onto the windward side and let run forward of the beam to prevent it from sailing by lee and gybving on you and hoist staysail cleated off of windward deck flying to leeward.

Watch people suffer from sail envy as you pass them by.

As a general rule I tell clients who have not sailed a cat ketch to wait a whiel for staysail. Get comfortable with sailing the cat ketch and then add a staysail to your bag of tricks.

Thanks, I already have the sail, so I may as well get the rigging up since we have a lot of light summer winds.

- Edward

[Ray Frechette Jr]

The staysail is an awesome light air sail addition.

Definitely earned a permanent spot on my Cat Ketch boats.

Early on I would play with it only in very light airs until you are very comfortable sailing in stronger airs with stock sails.

[ecgossett]

I've followed all the advice and hopefully gotten all the right hardware for my staysail minus the sheet line (West Marine talked my wife into 40ft of 1/2" new england line at $1.13 a foot for it).

Does anyone have better info for layout then the boat design drawings?? When I take down sail for the block on end of mizzen boom will I have to disconnect and move rope onto other side or can I use two? I looked at photos online but no closeup photos of system, any photos would be appreciated.

[Brent]

You can run the sheet from the tack of the staysail...to the lee side of the mizzen sprit...around the windward side of the mizzen...back to the staysail tack forming and endless sheet that does not have to be rerouted when gybing. The staysail still is dropped, the boat gybed, and the sail rehoisted , but at least the sheet is ready.

I recommend 3/16 or 1/4 inch sheet for good sail shape in light air.

[MisterMoon]

Where did you get your staysail, and how much did you pay for it?

I really want one because I find my boat to underpowered downwind and broad reaching in light airs.

[ecgossett]

Windancer Sails in Jacksonville, Tom White! The pattern should be in his computer. All three sails where under $900, but where bought together not individually.

[Michael Collins]

You have a halyard on the forward end of the mizzen mast.

There is an eyestrap on both sides of the boat just aft of the main mastabout a foot back on the outside edge of the deck "Securely"screwed down into the inwhales.

You place a hor cleat under the side decks aft of the mizzen mast about 2-3 feet back that you cleat off the fall of the halyard on the windward side to provide some staying forcees to the mizzen mast.

The clew of the sail has a sheet attached that goes aft to a block attached to the end of the Mizzen sprit boom.

Ray, if you are out in the boat this weekend, can you get any pictures? Sorry. Seriously, do you have any pictures? It has been a while since I have been in Doug's boat, but this sounds different than what I remember. I am hoping that images will help me remember if this is the way we have it.

Thank you,

Michael

[ecgossett]

Flew the staysail today... Can some people send me photos of there's flying, and attached hardware including both points for lines running?? I'm not sure I had enough line forward (does it need to be adjustable?), and that kept the sail from going all the way up the mast. I do need a cleat to tie of halyard instead of wrapping it around mast.

What do you guys attach staysail sheet to?? I was adjusting off the mizzen boom, it had some good force behind it. I managed to do wing on wing with the staysail opposite the main sail. Talk about speed in light air. However trying to fill the sail in 90 degrees was another matter, I think I need to change some adjustments or get it higher.

It does take two people to handle unless I get a sock for it.. I had thought I only had to move back sheet, but the front attachment has to be unattached for tacking or detach halward and pull staysail underneath main.

[Ray Frechette Jr]

I'm not sure I had enough line forward (does it need to be adjustable?), and that kept the sail from going all the way up the mast. I do need a cleat to tie of halyard instead of wrapping it around mast.

When I hoist my staysail, I have a small bead tied in halyard near top of sial that bears up against the halyard bolck at the mast head.

You do not need and adjustable line on tack, but you do need it long enough to allow head of sail to rise up enough. Make sure you do not have the sail configured worong. I did make mistake of raising the clew instead of the head once...

Yes, staysail halyard needs to be cleated of under the windward side deck aft of the mizzen mast ona horn cleat. Thje staiysail imposes significant load ont he mizzen mast and the halyard provides some staying forces. Basically you want the luff and the staysail halyard to bisect the mizzen mast both to windward deck to provide good staying forces.

Staysail halyard is not cleated on the mast.

What do you guys attach staysail sheet to?? I was adjusting off the mizzen boom, it had some good force behind it. I managed to do wing on wing with the staysail opposite the main sail. Talk about speed in light air. However trying to fill the sail in 90 degrees was another matter, I think I need to change some adjustments or get it higher.

Staysail sheet block attaches to clew of mizzen boom. Long rope coming back to helmsman.

Staysail needs to be constantly played with changes in windspeed direction. Just trim it till luff fills. If in doubt , let it out. retrim to fill luff.

It does take two people to handle unless I get a sock for it.. I had thought I only had to move back sheet, but the front attachment has to be unattached for tacking or detach halward and pull staysail underneath main.

Yep, only downside to staysail is the need to doue it and rehoist on every tack. You need to reset the staysail sheet and re cleat the hayard on new windward deck after tacking too in addition to reattaching the tack on windward deck.

Not a sail to bother with when constanly tacking but a joy in light airs to have aboard for long runs and reaches.

I can keep stayasail filled to about 70 degreees tin true but the drag to lift ratio goes down at around 80 degrees to true.

[wkisting]

Mine is essentially the same as Ray describes...

- Small knot in staysail halyard to prevent it from hoisting fully. Going by memory, the knot leaves maybe 7-10" of slack between halyard block and top edge of staysail... probably varies by mast size, though, so you'll have to experiment.

- Staysail sheet is attached to a single block with a stainless clip on it. I clip it onto the short length of rope between the end of my mizzen sprit and the mizzen sheet. Sometimes I clip it onto the top of the leeward cam cleat for the mizzen sheet because the lower sheeting angle seems to help the staysail fill on some points of sail.

- I played around with the length of the line at the tack of the staysail a LOT before I found what seemed to be the right length (just kept retying the line to change the amount of slack). Make sure it's attached to the windward rail, of course.

It is very hard to photograph the staysail because it is so large, but I once dared to set the tiller-tamer and run forward to snap a quick shot with my wide-angle lens. You can view those pics in the second and third photo on this page: http://www.roguepaddler.com/cs20t.htm

In the third photo, you can see the halyard tied off to a cleat under the windward side deck to act as a makeshift stay, as Ray mentioned.

[ecgossett]

I'm not sure what the proper hookup on mine is.. I might have my sail the wrong way. I assumed the grommet went forward, and the strap eyes where other ways, I could be wrong. I guess I need to measure.

I see what I did wrong, I hooked the sail into the base of the main mast, not off to the side.

How heavy are your staysail? Mine is ripstop nyloN.

[wkisting]

I see what I did wrong, I hooked the sail into the base of the main mast, not off to the side.

That's probably the source of the trouble. You need to install an eye loop (padeye) on the rail on each side. The forward edge of the staysail hooks into whichever one is on the windward side as you hoist the sail. I could take measurements off our boat to tell you their exact placement, but the CS17's spacing is probably different than on our CS20. Maybe call Graham or wait for another CS17 owner to chime in on the measurements.

Not sure on the weight of ours... haven't looked at it in awhile, but it's much lighter material than the main and mizzen sails.

[ecgossett]

Which edge of the sail do you hook into the padeye? The leech side (17') goes forward right?? Some of the photos look like sail was hung in different ways.

[wkisting]

On my staysail, I think the shortest side is the leech (running from head to clew). The foot is longer (from clew to tack). The longest side is the luff (head to tack). I'm going off my imperfect memory, but I think that's right. To put it another way in case my terminology is wrong... if you're looking at the boat from the side while the staysail is up, the shortest edge is located aft running (vertically) from the top of the mizzen mast down to the clew/sheet (usually attached to the end of the mizzen sprit), and the longest edge runs diagonally from the top of the mizzen to the padeye on the rail near the main mast.

Does that sound right to everyone else?

[ecgossett]

Per this drawing that sounds right for dimensions.

[wkisting]

Yep, that's exactly how I remember mine being arranged.

[ecgossett]

Staysail up at Cherry Creek

[Peter HK]

Hi Edward

The tack of the staysail attaches to the windward fitting on the gunwale. You have it attached to the leeward one. The main should be to leeward of the staysail ie the staysail is between the main and mizzen.

Cheers

Peter HK