snotters

[hokeyhydro]

Although the wood/epoxy beach catamaran I built for my daughter is a blast, it requires messing with sheets, the cunningham, the vang, and of course a lot of dancing about on the tramp to trim the cat and preform a perfect roll tack. Not my style. I am a slacker who has been known to fish without bait on the hook so a hungry fish won't interrupt my fishing nap. So the cat ketch appeals to me. Laid back sailing - yes!

I have plans for a CS-15 and CS-17. The 17 is more popular but I think a 15 would fit me better as a single hand rig. Reviewing the plans I have a fair idea how to rig a snotter. But since I like to mess with different ideas I'm thinking a wishbone boom. Yeah, I know, a wishbone *might* be marginally better in light wind, but generally not worth the building effort. I like building weird stuff. And, as I mentioned, I am lazy and a wishbone boom would be a nice platform for lazy jacks to catch the reefed sail. Even the name "lazy jackz' appeals to me.

My question: How does one rig a wishbone boom? Same as the snotter on a sprit? I envision a line to the clew as being adjustable in length for a new reefing clew distance, and the usual snotter rig to adjust boom tension, but would a wishbone also need a line to jack up the nose?

[DISTELTK]

Although the wood/epoxy beach catamaran I built for my daughter is a blast, it requires messing with sheets, the cunningham, the vang, and of course a lot of dancing about on the tramp to trim the cat and preform a perfect roll tack. Not my style. I am a slacker who has been known to fish without bait on the hook so a hungry fish won't interrupt my fishing nap. So the cat ketch appeals to me. Laid back sailing - yes!

I have plans for a CS-15 and CS-17. The 17 is more popular but I think a 15 would fit me better as a single hand rig. Reviewing the plans I have a fair idea how to rig a snotter. But since I like to mess with different ideas I'm thinking a wishbone boom. Yeah, I know, a wishbone *might* be marginally better in light wind, but generally not worth the building effort. I like building weird stuff. And, as I mentioned, I am lazy and a wishbone boom would be a nice platform for lazy jacks to catch the reefed sail. Even the name "lazy jackz' appeals to me.

My question: How does one rig a wishbone boom? Same as the snotter on a sprit? I envision a line to the clew as being adjustable in length for a new reefing clew distance, and the usual snotter rig to adjust boom tension, but would a wishbone also need a line to jack up the nose?

[wkisting]

As I understand it, the aft edge of the wishbone is always attached to the clew. When reefing, you ease the snotter so more of the wishbone can slide forward of the mast, and the snotter also holds the wishbone up (no need for a separate jack line, if I've understood your question correctly). It's essentially the same as with a sprit, except that the wishbone takes a bit more time to rig. Once rigged, it captures the sail nicely so that when you reduce sail, it's essentially contained within the center of the wishbone. Add a set of lazy jacks and it should further ease sailhandling... so I'm told. No firsthand experience myself.

I was very attracted to the wishbone idea, but once I sailed with the basic sprits, I really think sprits are preferable. They are so simple and quick to rig, light and relatively easy to stow, and offer very good sailing performance. I wouldn't want to add the few extra hassles of a wishbone, the much greater build complexity, or the additional weight... and I don't think you'd see much performance benefit from the wishbone.

[Peter HK]

My experience with wishbone booms is limited to a 33ft Tri I once owned and raced. The lazy jacks were very nice- never needed to tie in the reefs as the sail just sat there. Reefing was with separate reefing lines to each point, starting on the starboard side up to the reef point and down to the port side boom (at a carefully planned point so the angles were right) and run along the boom to a winch and cleat. As there was quite a lever arm athwartships we managed to break/bend the boom a couple of times.

It was permanently set. Setting one on a CS15 would be a bit more complicated than the standard sprit and probably best if it could be split to fit around the mast.

They look pretty.

The snotter is the same.

Cheers

Peter HK

[hokeyhydro]

Yes, Wes, I figure a no-call on performance, especially since I will build the sails myself. I'll probably start with sprits but forsee a wishbone in the future - just for giggles.

Peter HK: Okay, snotter is the same - got it. Reefed sail flops in the lazy jacks, no need to tie it up - perfect. Reffing lines attached to the boom? The visual I get is a line from starboard boom through the new reefed clew point, back to port boom and cleated off (no need for a winch on a 15). So if I have two reef points I have a total of three attachment lines (original clew plus two reefed clews), two of which are loose when not employed. Drop sail to reef point, detach prior clew line (outhaul more or less), attach new line, cinch it up and go. Is that it?

I should add - I also envision the "reefing lines" are already threaded through their respective clew grommet and wishbone boom attachment points and just require tightening.

[Ken_Potts]

Peter HK: Okay, snotter is the same - got it. Reefed sail flops in the lazy jacks, no need to tie it up - perfect. Reffing lines attached to the boom? The visual I get is a line from starboard boom through the new reefed clew point, back to port boom and cleated off (no need for a winch on a 15). So if I have two reef points I have a total of three attachment lines (original clew plus two reefed clews), two of which are loose when not employed. Drop sail to reef point, detach prior clew line (outhaul more or less), attach new line, cinch it up and go. Is that it?

I have not sailed a wishbone rig but here's my uneducated guess.

If you have three clews (regular and two reefs) I think you'll also need three tacks. So you'd ease the snotter, let out the halyard, move the clew and tack attachments to the chosen reef, raise the halyard and tension the snotter. Then you could decide what to do with the reefed part of the sail. Just to be sure - You're talking about sails that run in tracks, right?

[hokeyhydro]

Yes, Ken, sails in tracks - actually slotted 1/2" CPVC track ala Dudley Dix and his Paperjet. I used the CPVC track on the catamaran and it works well. Yep, 3 tacks. Drop the sail via halyard, hook up new tack and clew, snug halyard and snotter. Peter's description leads me to believe his wishbone was pre-rigged with clew lines at every point and all one needed to do was slack the abandoned clew point and snug up the new one. Reefed sail will be flaked nicely in the lazy lacks (I hope) and that is the reason I'm thinking wishbone.

[wkisting]

If preferred, I'm fairly certain you can also rig a wishbone so the aft end of the wishbone is simply moved up to the next clew for reefing, in much the same way that a sprit can also be reefed. I realize some folks rig their sprits for slab reefing, but the alternative is simply to move the sprit end up to the new (reef position) clew and let more of the sprit go forward of the mast by slackening the snotter. A wishbone can be reefed the same way, as I understand it.

What Peter described...

Reefing was with separate reefing lines to each point, starting on the starboard side up to the reef point and down to the port side boom (at a carefully planned point so the angles were right) and run along the boom to a winch and cleat.

... is more like the slab reefing method with a sprit and more likely to strain/stress the wishbone athwartships (as Peter also mentioned breaking a boom or two). Slab reefing is preferred by some for sprits because otherwise the sail might flap free and be difficult to recapture while you are trying to move the sprit end up to the next clew. With a wishbone, this is a fairly moot concern (I'm assuming) since the sail would remain trapped inside the wishbone regardless. So I would lean toward always attaching the clew to the aft end of the wishbone (the strongest point) rather than to a reefing line further up the wishbone. If you didn't want to have to release the sail before attaching to the next reefing clew, you could probably rig a series of lines all leading from the wishbone aft end to each clew. Then you could simply snug up the desired line up as you take in a reef, while easing the snotter an equivalent amount to let the excess wishbone move forward of the mast.

Not sure if that made sense, but I can picture it easily and my gut tells me it would be simpler and stronger than leading lines from either side of the wishbone.

[Peter HK]

All the reefing lines were permanently rigged.

The clew stayed attached, and reefing just involved pulling on the reefing line led along the boom as well as dealing with the tack as usual. In terms of stress remember this was a 33ft long, 28ft wide tri with a large rig. I doubt you have to worry about breaking things on a CS15. Shifting the outhaul works OK with a roachy sail as the foot length of the reefed sail is not too different from the foot. If you have a battenless sail the boom either has to shift a long way forward or the outhaul is a very long...in either case the geometry changes and leads to poor control of sail shape. A "topping lift" to the front of the wishbone can help but all this extra rigging on a CS15 would be a pain.

I thought about a wishbone but decided on sprits.

Peter HK

[tom151]

Take a look at the diagram labelled under "JIFFY REEFING..." part-way down the page here...

http://marina.fortunecity.com/breakwater/274/1999/0701/Index.htm#Reefing%20Sharpie%20Sprit%20Sails

looks like a good way to do it (to me at least).

Easing the halyard and tightening the appropriate clew reef line (with it's dedicated block on the sprit), then tightening the reef tack with a cunningham through the cringle seems fast and simple - well worth the expense of the extra block(s) and line - especially if you sail where winds are regularly variable.

I'll go that way myself as I don't want to accomodate large changes to the snotter position or geometry. (geometry of reef layouts on the sail may need to planned accordingly).

I will do a "half-wishbone" (a little c/fiber goes a long way in this case) as I see no good reason to go as far as to the full wishbone (lazy jacks, etc).

Something like Steven Hirsh's nice little dinghy shown below...

Note that this half-wishbone-sprit also used a fixed attachment for the sprit to the mast - as opposed to the usual snotter rat's nest. I'm tempted to go this way as well - as I expect that with the sail on a track the tuning of snotter postition can be accomodated by adjusting the height of the sail - but still worrying that aspect

[hokeyhydro]

Thanks all. Oh, I'm in the south now, so Thanks y`all, or maybe Thanks all y`all as my South Carolina friend sez.

Got the basic layout sketched now. Wishbone - snotter w/option to adjust height, and of course fine tuning snotter height with sail height adjustment. Clew grommet lines led to wishbone at a point to apply outhual tension in the proper direction, and the option to attach/de-attach clew lines to achieve desired reef point. Of course the tack will change as well.

All this mental machination and I know I will go with sprits until I figure out the cat ketch sailing drill. Then I will experiment . . .