Jump to content

Weekender Tiller question (for frank?)


markfitz
 Share

Recommended Posts

We are at the point where we are placing pulleys....since we decided early on that we wanted a tiller and not a wheel, we're wondering how to rig the boom pulleys on the back.  The wheel plan calls for one transom mounted pulley right smack in the middle, and we know we have to do something different, but we're not sure exactly what.  I tried to do a search on "tiller boom pulley" combinations but didn't find anything specific.  If someone can point me in the right direction, either to a thread or pics, I'd appreciate it!  Thanks!

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I used a four part arrangement to avoid having a bridle at the stern.  It gets the main sheet up and out of the way, for the most part.  Here's how it looks when completed:

msheet1.jpg

I started by splicing a very ugly loop in the end of the main sheet around a padeye on the port side.  I later had to add a galvanized or stainless eye to this to stop chafing:

msheet2.jpg

And then it reeves up through the aft block on the boom and down to the starboard side to another block:

msheet3.jpg

msheet5.jpg

Here's a pic with the boom out to starboard ... in practice, the main sheet remains taut:

msheet6.jpg

One advantage this has is that you are trimming the main sail from the starboard quarter when the boom is off to starboard ("lee side"), and that helps you keep the sail a bit flatter than if you are trimming it from the center of the stern.  On a gaffer, keeping the sail as flat as possible helps with pointing ability.  Roger C. Taylor in his book "Knowing the Ropes" says "With this rig, the boom can be hauled down hard to leeward to take some twist out of the sail when trimmed close-hauled, giving the same effect as a traveler."

I like it because it provides a lot of room to lift the tiller (I made mine so it swiveled up to access the hatch I put in the lazerette.) 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks -- the pictures help.  Sorry about all the non-nautical terminology.  Neither my dad nor I have ever sailed, so we don't know what all the technical terms are yet.  :-[.  (In researching this, I just learned what a boom vang is, for instance. Is that the same as the "traveler" mentioned below?)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks -- the pictures help.  Sorry about all the non-nautical terminology.  Neither my dad nor I have ever sailed, so we don't know what all the technical terms are yet.  :-[.  (In researching this, I just learned what a boom vang is, for instance. Is that the same as the "traveler" mentioned below?)

A boom vang is used to keep the boom from lifting up, so its kind of similar to what's happening with the main sheet.  Typically a boom vang is mounted to the bottom of a boom a few feet aft of the mast and leads back to the base of the mast (or cabin top).  You really don't need one on a Weekender.  Even the bigger gaffers don't usually have them; the booms are big and heavy on the bigger ships.  What's funny is that the top spar ... the gaff up at the top of the sail ... sometimes has a "gaff vang" on it leading down to the side decks.  Again, not something we need on a Weekender.

Here's a picture of a traveler on a production boat.  Not the same as you would use on a Weekender, but you can get the idea.  In this type, you use a metal rod and a block to "travel" from side to side for the main sheet (there are also "tracks" for more modern boats).  I think this is called a "horse" when the metal rod is elevated.  The problem with this set up on the Weekender is it would "capture" the tiller so you couldn't swing it up to access the lazarrette if you put a hatch opening in the top of it.

post-0-129497639507_thumb.jpg

post-2-129497683709_thumb.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On Frank's first posting in this thread (reply No. 2), his second photo....

Wouldn't it be better to have that eye rotated 90 deg, so that the load from the line is in-line with the long axis of the eye?

Probably; that would allow it to follow the curve of the padeye as the main sheet rotates out to the lee side with the boom.  It did work well, but the line did chafe until I put a galvanized eye in it.  My brother changed it out to a stainless eye when he took the boat (the galvanized one had started to rust). 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

OK, that all makes sense -- I think we are going to copy frank's method.  I do have another related question -- we got our sails from stevenson projects and they appear to be very nice.  Now we are wondering about the other blocks. We started out with hardware store pulleys, but then had to buy a harken for the cheekblock, and we were amazed at the difference.  We were looking at the the areas on deck where the plans say to use a pulley and a spring to run that particular line down to the cockpit, but it seemed like it would make more sense to put another cheekblock pulley or something like it instead since it seemed to want to be sideways. 

That confused us a bit, but it did get us to thinking it would be beneficial to just use all "real" blocks -- but there seems to be so many types (e-bay, for instance) that we're not sure what we are looking for/buying.  If we wanted to replace all the plan's pulleys with real hardware, does anyone have a list of what we should buy for the swap outs?  Thanks! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Harkin ball bearing blocks are great.  I used them for all the sheets (main sheet, jib sheets).  For the halyards, I used less expensive sleeve bearing blocks from Wichard (not sure they are imported anymore).  The old advice used to be that you don't need the free running ability that the ball bearing blocks have, and on heavier rigs the weight might cause "flat spots" in the bearing race.  I don't think that's really a concern on our little light boats. 

You can sometimes find the sleeve bearing blocks for $4 to $6 ... quite a savings from the typical $15 a pop for small boat blocks from Harkin.  Duckworks Magazine has some less expensive blocks that would be suitable for the Weekender ... see http://www.duckworksbbs.com/hardware/blocks/single.htm for the single blocks from about $4 on. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

Another question regarding block placement -- we are trying to figure out if the jib control and the peak halyard come back to the cockpit on the same side or different sides of the boat -- we assume different, but we are probably wrong.

Also, we're wondering where to place them.  The drawings show them sort of in the middle of the cockpit, but at that point you can't get to the underside so you have to resort to screws instead of bolts.  We were wondering what the drawback would be to putting the peak halyard cleat farther up near the cabin so you weren't sitting on it if you sat on the edge of the boat.  How often do you have to adjust that vs. the jib?  Would it be better to have them both on cam cleats?

Thanks!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Most of us lead the halyards back along the cabin top.  The throat and peak halyard for the main sail can be routed there easily, with two cam cleats to hold them if you like.  I like cam cleats rather than regular cleats in this location because they are lower profile.  Its more convenient to be able to grab the peak halyard and allow the gaff to come down a bit to depower the sail if you have to ... much easier than going up to the mast as the plans have it.

hal2pit1.jpg

hal2pit2.jpg

For the jib sheet, you position the cam cleat as per the plans, on the side decks about half way back toward the transom.  If you are not using the self tacking boom on the jib, you'll have two sheets, and one on either side of the boat makes the most sense.  The reason is that you will want easy access to it while holding the wheel or tiller and main sheet in your hand.  You can screw a cam cleat into the side deck; especially after its been fiberglassed.  Use a good bedding compound under it, because the side decks do get wet and screws are notorious for allowing water in to rot the wood.  You won't need more than a tube of bedding compound for the entire boat.  Some people use 3M 5200 for the permanent things like cam cleats, and it lasts a long time.  If you think you might want to move them later, use either 3M 4200 or one of the other boat caulks like Boat Life, etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Markfitz  The way I did it was to run the throat  and peak lines down the mast to about level with the top of the cabin there I mounted a double block on the mast then two eyes each line back to the back of the top of the cabin there I mounted my cam cleat, mine is on the starbard side both peak and throat the jib lines I ran one line on both sides of the cabin.  I know this is as clear as mud  but maybe it will help until you can get to look at aomeones in pearson. Bud

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bud's method of bringing down the halyards to a block at the bottom of the mast would be preferred, as the boom will foul the halyards as Frank's photo shows. Use fairleads to bring the lines back to the cockpit.

The traditional locations for halyards on a sloop are main to starboard and jib to port, though there is no logical reasoning behind this arrangement.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So the throat and peak halyards just come straight down to the top of the cabin? They don't get in the way of the main sail?  I'm having trouble picturing that...so you don't use the cheek block on the mast at all?

My personal preference, but when I tried raising and lowering the sail with a cheek block the halyards would get fouled in the gaff jaws.  Others probably found a way around this, but I just moved them out to the cabin top and the halyards stay out of the inside of the jaws that way.

They give enough so that when the boom and gaff come their way they just give a little.  In reality, it is the shrouds that prevent the gaff from going to far to port or starboard, and sometimes the mainsail is up against the shrouds.  But because I'm a generally happy sailor, with a stupid grin on my face most of the time, none of that bothered me!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the halyards to starboard is because most people are starboard handed. It was done for half ass I mean half fast sailors like me. When you get over powered by a gust and turn the boom loose it goes out about a foot and stops because you are standing on the tail of the line. You reach your pucker point and don't have time to look for why it hung, you can reach the peak halyard (the out side line that is white with red fleeks on it) knock it out of the cam clear, spill some air and regroup. Bud :o

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share


Supporting Members

Supporting Members can create Clubs, photo Galleries, don't see ads and make messing-about.com possible! Become a Supporting Member - only $12 for the next year. Pay by PayPal or credit card.




×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.