EC 22

[Joe Anderson]

You are welcome around my campfire anytime. I promise to use a different pot.

[Joe Anderson]

I have some questions about the cockpit seat hatches.

I want to do the self draining hatches and have a plan sheet for them.

The plans do not show any beams running under the seats from the cockpit side (vertical portion of seat) to the hull.

On the build CD you can see that Graham installed beams on either side of the hatch opening.

I wonder if these beams should be spaced a short distance from the opening or if it would be better to be able to glue the outside coaming that is the inside portion of the self draining hatch directly to the beam.

This would require that the beams be very precisely placed.

There also seems to be an option as to when the seat tops are installed relative to the hatch drainage channel.

Most builders seem to install the seat tops first.

However I think Scott Dufour installed the hatch drainage channel before installing the seat tops. I think this would allow you to attach the drainage channel directly to the seat beams.

This looks like one of those jobs I will understand after I have started it, or maybe not until I have finished it.

I wonder if there are any tips from those who have been this way before.

[John Turpin]

I was going to add some such beams, but found that I didn't need them.  I was going to just add them after the hatch frames went in.  It would have been possible to insert epoxied-up beams through the hatch and clamp them in place along side the frames to dry.  This was my plan, but the seats were plenty strong without them, so I dropped the idea.  But, the Lapwing benches are smaller than the EC22, so the bigger boat's seats might flex more.

[Joe Anderson]

Thanks John I had not thought of slipping the beams up through the hatch after the hatch drainage coaming was in place.

[Joe Anderson]

There is a tremendous number of skills and a lot of information that a first time builder needs to acquire. I have learned a lot researching old threads, following current builds or posting questions on this forum.

Sometimes I need help that I can not get from any source I can think of. That is when I use my ace a little treasure that Carla included in my plans.

[Hirilonde]

Oooh, so it is like a Bat Phone only different?

[Joe Anderson]

Yeah I guess it is rather like the Bat Phone. I have only used the Grahamphone for serious conversation in rather critical situations.

The best time to use it is just before making a costly mistake.

Using the Grahamphone just after making a costly mistake has a calming affect but the results do not tend to be as satisfactory.

I do not know how other builders use the Grahamapone.

To tell you the truth I haven't had that much experience using the Grahamaphone.

For the longest time I thought of it has kind of a hotline. Like the phone we had between the USA and Soviet Union.

I was reluctant to use it.

[hokeyhydro]

I use the TechiePhone.  The WEST techie is very helpful, and the 3M techie as well.  Other techies - Sailrite, and Duckworks. Gotta question, call or email and help is there.

[Joe Anderson]

I got my centerboard out of the concrete overshoes and into a lead slipper.

Not much lighter but much more hydrodynamic.

[brentkend]

I have faired with the Makita 9227 and with the Festool RO125, as well as with the longboard.  I found the Makita very hard to control, created a ton of dust, and I quickly gave it up in favor of the Festool.  The Festool had an integrated vacuum dust collection, and could easily switch from RO to circular sanding.  It was a bit pricey, but worth it (dust collection in my garage, much more efficient at removing material than a regular RO sander).

My fairing process would constitute knocking off the flat areas and major high spots of fairing compound with the Festool, fair with the longboards, then do the final high grit finish sanding with the Festool.  The main fairing job was with the longboards and lots of sweat.

That said, there was a decent article in WoodenBoat number 210, page 90 on "Fairing by Machine" which shows a Makita 9227 look-alike fitted with a custom rectangular pad which shows interesting possibilities.

Brent

L7 #4, Wild Goose

http://home.comcast.net/~ritakend/site/

[Joe Anderson]

Thanks for the tip on the WB article. Looks a lot like the rig that Peter used.

May be more aggressive than what I need want.

But after a few hours behind the long board?

I will take a peek at the Festools, but that is all.

[Hirilonde]

.........I am starting to think about sanding...........

Now that's a mistake, its bad enough that it has to be done without thinking about it ahead of time 

The centerboard looks great.  That mold idea really gets the weight where it will do the most good.

[John Burritt]

I've used a Milwaukee 1/2 sheet sander.  Not quite as good as a long board, but easier.  Don't run the risk of making depressions like you can w/ an r/o.

[hokeyhydro]

I have a semi-flexible star shaped fiberglass sandpaper backer for a 10" rotary angle grinder.  Got it at an auto body paint shop. Even with a honking 10" tool one can feather and fair with the star shaped backer. It also "floats", as in can spin a little relative to the drive arbor. But near the end - gotta use a longboard and sweat equity.

[Joe Anderson]

I do not recall much being said about joinery.

How do you decide how to attach the solid pieces of wood?

This is a butt joint lapped by a piece of 6mm plywood. Strong in compression. Not so good in shear. Does not weaken either piece of wood.

[paul_stewart]

Joe,  do wait for the experts to speak but for what little it's worth, on the CS20 we used joinery as represented in your bottom two photos  --diagonal cuts (which I believe is what Graham recommended), and occasionally the "diagonal half lap" (in the very last photo) for cometic reasons.    --Paul

[Hirilonde]

The diagonals really make a big difference in avoiding splits under load.  I like these 2:

[Joe Anderson]

I like those Dave, Thanks.

I will go sharpen my chisel.

[Tom Lathrop]

The main thing to remember about these joints is that they have very little "stand alone" strength. They are not really a complete joint by themselves.  They depend on the covering board or plywood to distribute the load to the main timbers.    What they mainly do is to minimize stress concentration that would occur with a simple butt join.  The 45 degree cut and tang is about as good as can be had in this situation.  Never seen the half lap version used on a deck beam other than on larger boats where the joint is visible overhead..

[Joe Anderson]

I decided to test empirically the buoyancy of my centerboard.