Experience with store-bought hatches?

[Jeff MacDonald]

I'm trying to decide whether to use store-bought hatches in my CS17 or stick with the per-plan wooden ones. As with a lot of things, we often hear mostly about the troubles folks have had with things. IIRC, JeffM started out with some on Beatrice Ann that had no permanent attachment to the opening; just a spider that slipped inside to press the cover against the outside of the opening. I see from the pictures in his capsize test that he's not using those any longer. If you've installed store-bought hatches could you tell me what you installed and how they're working out for you?

Thanks.

[PAR]

Commercially available hatches in this size range will be from $300 to $450. The closest size generally is the 16x16. The next size down is 12x 18 or a 12x12. A 12x12 may be as low as $200.

You could use a utility hatch which is a rectangular deck plate on hinges, with a matching frame. These are designed as storage locker hatches, often seen in soles or cockpit seat tops. They run around $60 to $80.

I think a Lewmar hatch (or other brand) would look out of place somehow on a CS-17.

[Tom Lathrop]

Jeff,

Are you speaking about the new seat hatches made from Grahams CNC machine?  I have looked at the plans and think these will do well and can be made as water proof as the expensive store bought kind that Paul is talking about.  They should work as well as the fiberglass based ones that we have molded in the past.  Mine are shop molded fiberglass and are essentially waterproof in any normal situation and will come up dry from a capsize. 

The fiberglass ones are not available since they are very labor intensive to make and no one would pay what it is worth to make them. 

If you have an older CS not from the CNC, Graham will probably sell you the kit for the hatches.  The hatch tops are cut from the glued up seats just like the earlier ones and the complicated inside drain channel parts are what he can cut on the CNC.  I may be speaking out of turn but you can ask him.

The less expensive plastic flush mount hatches are not waterproof in my experience but may still be adequate for storage space.

If you are thinking of hatches on the foredeck or aft deck, ignore this.

[Jeff MacDonald]

Yeah, I wasn't considering real Bomar hatches. Inspection plates is what they call what I had in mind:

http://www.foreandaftmarine.com/INSPECTIONPLATESBECKSEN.htm

http://www.foreandaftmarine.com/INSPECTIONPLATESBOWMAR.htm

I am thinking about using these for the seats, foredeck, and aft bulkhead.

Anyone have any they like?

(disclaimer: I have no affinity for, or affiliation with, Fore and Aft Marine; they just came up first in the google search.)

[Ken_Potts]

Jeff - I think the answer would depend on whether Ray is building a kit or building on his mold.  If he's building from a kit I would go with the CNC hatches provided.  I'm not the idol worshipper type but Graham's got a lot of experience with these boats (hee, hee) and he knows what he's doing.  If Ray's building on his mold I'd ask him for his honest opinion before making the choice.

One thought - I've taken a few three-day trips on my boat and I've not used my seat compartments yet.  I've got two seat hatches on each side that might as well be glassed over because the rest of the boat sucks gear up so well that I haven't needed to use the space - And I'm not a minimalist.  You might think about some small watertight inspection ports in lieu of real hatches in the seats.

If you do go with seat hatches I don't think they need to be watertight in a capsize but they really should shed water when the boat is upright just to make life easier.  I built the seat hatches exactly wrong (against the designer's advice) and I'm speaking from experience (upright and inverted).  My boat's hatches for the fore and aft compartments are mostly watertight and are on the fore and aft decks but if I were building today I'd probably do the forepeak hatch the same way and put the lazarette hatch in the rear bulkhead (just personal preference).

[Gordy Hill]

Jeff,

I had the plastic hatches very much like the ones you're considering. They sucked! They were rather efficient when it came to keeping water in. They were terrible at keeping water out. I was really amazed to find they couldn't do what they were designed for and cost so much. I've seen Graham's version and I certainly would choose them on my next boat.

My two cents....

[wkisting]

Don't go with commercial hatches. I've used them extensively in the past and haven't had much trouble with leaking if you use the round screw-in type; however, Graham's designed hatches (in the plans) are well worth the labor: wide, spacious, easy to open, very effective at draining away water. They are tedious to build, but if you take your time and install them carefully, they are VERY convenient and completely waterproof while the boat remains upright. I haven't capsized our CS20, but with a good gasket, I suspect they'll stay waterproof upside down, also.

I built four of them for our CS20, but with the table saw set in position to cut each part, I was able to crank out all the matching parts in a matter of 90 minutes. Then I installed them and used a router to trim the top lip flush, or slightly lower (about 1/16" lower) to accommodate a thin 1/8" thick gasket. Worked great, looks great.

[Charlie Jones]

Ditto on "they sucked" I installed some in a CS 17 that the owner provided. I got to keep one spare and used it in the floor of our cockpit on the big boat. Over the anchor rode storage. I now have permanently wet anchor rode storage, every time it rains a bit. The things leak like sieves.

Now Graham has some ROUND hatches- about 10 inches or so, that look to be really watertight. Before the 200 next year I'm retro fitting the deck hatches on our little trimaran with some. Cause the screw in round ones we have leak also. They are SeaChoice and virtually worthless for keeping water out. Even with the O-rings heavily greased.

The hatches as designed in Graham's plans however, are great. As has been said, tedious to build, but WELL worth the effort.

[Peter HK]

The only type of cheap plastic hatch/port that I've found to be really watertight is the round press-in type that requires a lever to remove. As they are a cylinder within a cylinder with an O ring seal that deforms appropriately and so forms a high pressure seal, they actually work. The screw-in ones don't put enough pressure on the seal to deform it - usually the plastic threads deform first and then they are impossible to remove, so no one puts them in that hard.

Here's a photo of one.

Peter HK

[PAR]

I'm installing these on Ray's CS-17. They work well adn the price is right.

http://www.duckworksbbs.com/hardware/hatches/sd336140-160/index.htm

[JeffM]

I'll second Paul's opinion of the quarter-turn deckplates from Duckworks.  They cover my new dry-clothing and electronics compartments, which have stayed dry in spray and rain.  Meanwhile, my original So-Pac hatches (which leaked gallons in the brief capsize test Jeff mentioned) STILL leak like sieves.  The only things I put in those lockers are items already in separate plastic boxes.