track in wooden mast?

[Charles Neuman]

Can you make a wooden mast with a track in it? It doesn't seem impossible to rout a track in it, but it could weaken a hollow mast. Maybe I could make the mast walls a bit thicker to compensate.

Or... maybe attach a metal track on the outside of a wooden mast. If there is such a thing, that might work. If there isn't, then maybe it's possible to make a wooden track out of a hard wood, then attach it to the mast.

Charles Neuman

CS#135 (still haven't started yet, but the shop is finally winterized...)

[Howard]

Or... maybe attach a metal track on the outside of a wooden mast. If there is such a thing, that might work.

There is....it's called external track. It's a U shaped piece of metal that gets screwed to the mast. The slides go on the outside, vs. slugs or bolt ropes on internal slide masts. West Marine used to sell it, but it disappeard from last year's catalog. I'm sure it can be found.

[Charlie Jones]

Of course you can build a wooden mast with a groove for the bolt rope. It was done that way for years and years. The Gougeons have a write up on exactly how to do it (for an oval and/or tear drop section too) - contact the tech section by phone and ask- they'll sent it to you.. Simple to do also- no serious joinery required, but it does take epoxy.

As for the metal external track That's readily available also. That's what I have on Tehani, both mast and boom, in 5/8. The Sharpie I built from CLC also has it as did the Princess 22 I built in 2004.

You can see the track on the mast of Tehani in this shot.

Defender I believe, carries the slides, as does SailRite. Most any serious boating gear supplier can provide the track If you can't find it, I can order it in 12 foot lengths from my wholesale supply house and have it shipped to you. I imagine Graham can also.

When you are doing something that isn't " regular stuff" for these days, you kinda have to forget West Marine- they don't carry anything that they can't sell tons of- i.e.- stuff EVERY body uses

[Charles Neuman]

Wow, thanks. I thought everyone was going to convince me to use aluminum masts. That's more practical, of course, but if we were truly practical, we wouldn't build our own boats, right?

Charlie, are there more pictures of your boat somewhere? I tried the Gallery section, but there aren't many photos there. Didn't there used to be more? Where did everyone's boats go?

Charles

[Charlie Jones]

lol- don't know about the gallery, but I've got tons of pictures -

Here's one of my favorites of Tehani, taken from the Princess 22 I built for Travis, when he, Laura and I did a weekend together back in Sept I believe.

We're sailing in Matagorda Bay in the picture.

[john_manchester]

Charlie, which do you feel is better on a wood mast--external track or building the mast with a groove?

Of course it's all relative but I found the stainless track to be a little pricey (I'd spend about twice on track vs. what the stock for the masts cost--doesn't seem right). Right now I'm planning to make external track using 3/4" aluminum bar (like $3 per 8' section), supported probably on 3/8" square Al bar. Graham checked out the fit with a 5/8" slide, says it'll work with a little rounding on the back edge of the bar--thanks again Graham.

But maybe for the same effort would a groove work and hold up about as well? Would any extra maintenance be required for the groove?

[Charlie Jones]

I think that would kinda depend on the boat and how you'd use it.

The internal track works very well, as it does on aluminum masts, but when you lower the sail it all comes out of the groove and lays all over things. If you just daysail, put the sail up once and take it down at end of day, that would be fine. If it's a cruising boat where you'll be anchoring, lowering sail, reefing, etc, then you'd need slugs on the luff of the sail. Performance boats will usually choose the internal groove and bolt rope.

The external track requires slides sewn to the sail. It isn't as "clean" as an internal groove, but the sail goes up and comes down MUCH easier. When we shoot the halyard on Tehani ( or on the sharpie) the sdail comes down NOW. And it's captive- stays attached to the mast.

I always add slugs to my sails even with aluminum spars because I cruise my boats.

[double 7]

hi every body . another solution glued and screweed flex o rail track on mast 80% cheaper than stainless steel track;)same material graham had used for his dodger on deck for his cs 17. have a 3/16 rope sew on your sail, it work good except,you will need main sails feeders for the entrance of the rope in the flex o rail track.take care in handling mast not to hit flex o rail or storing it laying on track. i use that system for 2 year now,(i added main sail feeder this year it work very good i can raise sail from helm it is safer and faster.as said in earlier post it is not the ultimate solution but it is one of the solution . fern double7 core sound 77 spindrift 11'

[Designer]

Hi double 7,

I am glad that the flexirail has worked out , I have been wondering how well it worked.

About internal wooden luff track, I prefer to have slides or slugs on the luff so that the sail stays on the mast when lowered, like Charlie said.

I think that the 3/4" x 1/8" flatbar aluminum seems like a good low cost track. You do need to space it away from the mast and round the corners as John said.

[lsearle]

Charles, I have a copy of an article by Paul Goodwin from March 1990 titled "A Wooden Mast made easy". I think it is probably the method referred to by Charlie Jones earlier in this posting, but I could be wrong as I am redoing all my files at the moment.

It is for a wooden mast made of all straight machined timber with a slotted aluminium tube glued in to make the luff groove.

I have sent details of my contact as a private message but am not sure if I have done it right, as I have never sent one before on this forum.

Lawrie Searle

[Charlie Jones]

Isearle- that's probably the one. I had an online link to that article but I've apparently lost it. At least the site doesn't work any more. If you have the article I'd like having a copy.

Can you scan it and email it to me? If not, I can scan it here.

[Charles Neuman]

Ah yes, Sailrite, p. 32 (of the 2004-2005 catalog) has all the hardware and the track. Yes, the track seems pricy. I, too, was wondering about the flexarail. An external boltrope track seems like a good system. I notice there are also other boltrope options, such as aluminum (actually, it's called "awning track" and is made for awnings). That's encouraging to know that it has worked for a sail. I wonder if the folks at Sailrite would recommend it for that. I could always get a small piece of it and put some fabric in it with a boltrope or slug and see how much force it takes for it to fail.

I'll have to read up on the internal track on a wooden mast and see how much trouble it is.

I might opt for high-tech in the end, because I like the idea of being able to raise and lower the sail quickly and have the luff attached at all times. It seems like a good safety option. If I'm not sailing alone, I'll have my kids out with me (when they get old enough), and I'd rather feel 100% comfortable in the boat.

Charles

[Charles Neuman]

Here's a link to the Goodwin article:

A Wood Mast Made Easy

[lsearle]

OK guys, internet is a wonderful thing ain't it. It seems we have all been circling the same dead beast.

The article I've got is the Goodwin one that Charles has. So now we all have a copy of it and the internet link at last.

Lawrie Searle

[Charlie Jones]

Yup- that's the one. Apparently they have changed the address, so my link was dead. I've got it bookmarked again. May print it out this time