Wild_Dingo Posted January 26, 2004 Posted January 26, 2004 well Mike you do have my email phone number and address... I wasnt and never have had a problem with you You say "I was being trashed concerning several issues"... not by me! In the threads mentioned I wasnt questioning the posters comments but rather trying to get clarity of what they were saying to do... I also wanted to avoid a total pull down of the saws arbor which is what was being suggested... it that what you mean by "You were questioning several different opinions, as some was not telling you what you wanted to hear" of course I didnt want to hear that!!... gawd this is and was at that time a brand spanking new saw!! I am not a machinist I am not comfortable playing with arbors and such so of course I didnt want to hear that that is what I should do!... I have spent most of this evening with a machinist who works at setting up timber working machines as a living and he has gone over it from one end to the other and the machine is fine. There were three contributors to my problems with the machine... First the stance of myself when feeding a 10 - 12ft length without support extra support under the feed in side Second... the fence is not good enough as the rear end comes in too far still and must be checked after every pass Third... the motor hanging of the back not putting any tension on the belt when the blade was set low... a sand bag hung of the motor fixed that. So there are the problems the resolutions are simple 1 build another smaller width saw hoarse to hold the infeed get another fence and the sandbag which is done. I shall not be posting any questions on any board from here on if this is the type of crap one has to go through for doing so.
Guest Posted January 26, 2004 Posted January 26, 2004 You ask me and I told you. This last post was plain and readable to me. I cannot answer something if I cannot understand the problem. I cannot understand the problem. I actually never understood that it was new or used from the way you combined it into the original inquiry. As you may recall, many times people have spoke of my replies as being "Oyster English" right? You ask me direct, you get a direct answer from me. If you will also notice, my replies to many of the inquires have been cut back to almost none, and selective ones at best, concerning actual construction and glass technigues. I do not have a PE degree. This was part of the new rules when replying as to the responsibilty issues period. I cannot see, as many times I have stated this to you and the otheer board. You will also see many times I will have to edit my posts on there. . You desire to be upset when I reply to you of my reasons. That is part of day end and day out forum experiences I guess, from all of us that has put a lot of time and effort into some of the websites. Water over the damn for me. It bothers me to see people upset, but I am who I am, Shane. Nuff said from me.
Dave Fleming Posted January 26, 2004 Author Posted January 26, 2004 Well Shane, since YOU opened the bag here it is. I, as well you know, don't post nor read the Wooden Boat Forums anymore. The reasons were made clear when I posted my decision. Your dilemma was brought to my attention by some one who does. I read the thread and whilst reading it recalled when I had posted to a query of yours concerning you building a SAWN FRAME CARVEL PLANKED Murray Peterson Coaster Schooner. My post, to the best of my recollection, pointed out based on emperical knowledge and experience, was what I thought was needed in the way of machinery and tooling to accomplish the job ***plus*** the time and learning needed to begin such a daunting project. You were incensed that I would dare question what you could or could not do and what you might need to do it! I had some little experience with that design. I assisted ( 2 ) fellows buiding ( 2 ) Coasters and recall quite well the facilities and knowledge of both. They were experienced shipwrights and the projects flowed with few surprises. They shared a fully equipped and proper sized shop capable of handling the sizes of timber required. Too bad said I and, put you thereafter 'In Coventry'. Let me make something clear to ALL who read this. When I was but an apprentice I had some **ACES** journeymen as teachers AND I had some nasty ones too. I would receive this comment when assigned to work with one of the latter...'hell kid, if you think I am going to show you what I know you're crazy. It took me a lifetime to learn it and I ain't just passin' it on to some'green pea''. I vowed at that time that IF, if I was fortunate to learn somethings and be in a position to pass on what little I learned I would not hesitate to do so. I have earnesly tried to live up to that and I believe I have. To wit: http://media5.hypernet.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=008298;p=. Don't come to this Forum and complain that you were ignored or that information was kept from you. The operation of ANY piece of machinery depends on the intelligence and awareness of the operator. It should go without saying that self learning is the hardest of all but not impossible providing one is not impetious or rash. Folla? I treat everyone as civily as I can when first we meet. But, when I am literally spat upon all bets are off. There are ways to get your point of view across and yelling at someone is not one of them in my book. One of the principal reasons for me leaving the Wooden Boat Forums. the decline of civility. Edited to clean up some grammar etc..
Greg Luckett Posted January 26, 2004 Posted January 26, 2004 This Wild_Dingo person's attitude and whining are exactly why I do not spend much time on the Wooden Boat Forum. This whole thread is so out of character for messing-about.com that I am surprised Frank has not stepped in yet. I think we are on the edge, maybe over it, of breaking the one rule. Wild_Dingo, go back to whence you came and please leave us in peace.
Dave Fleming Posted January 26, 2004 Author Posted January 26, 2004 What about the initial post? No worth there?
Guest Posted January 26, 2004 Posted January 26, 2004 Greg, clarification is a long ways from any personal attack, No?
Frank Hagan Posted January 26, 2004 Posted January 26, 2004 There were three contributors to my problems with the machine...First the stance of myself when feeding a 10 - 12ft length without support extra support under the feed in side Second... the fence is not good enough as the rear end comes in too far still and must be checked after every pass Third... the motor hanging of the back not putting any tension on the belt when the blade was set low... a sand bag hung of the motor fixed that. So there are the problems the resolutions are simple 1 build another smaller width saw hoarse to hold the infeed get another fence and the sandbag which is done. I shall not be posting any questions on any board from here on if this is the type of crap one has to go through for doing so. You might go back and re-read the original post, Shane. I really don't think Dave was intending to insult you ... at least I didn't read it that way. My statement about reading the manual wasn't intended to be directed at you either, but was one of those things I feel I have to do from an integrity standpoint whenever my forum discusses things like this. Even though your question was specifically about your problem, on this forum the question was in a more general tone, and we were attempting to put together some tips and pointers for anyone setting up a machine. I read the original post on WBF, and chimed in over there too. I thought you would see this one, as you've been a frequent visitor here. So there certainly wasn't any intention on my part to have you embarrassed or insulted. I'm surprised you had to be told the post was here; if I had realized (or paying more attention!) I would have told you to check in myself. BTW - I don't think you violated our One Rule either; people can disagree and be passionate about things without resorting to name calling or personal attacks. And I think even in your frustration you didn't resort to that.
Simon Posted January 27, 2004 Posted January 27, 2004 Well this is a fine thing... thanks Simon for pointing this out. Erm, that wasn't me, although perhaps I should have ... Personallly I use a handheld circular saw bolted undeneath an old desk with a length of straightish wood clamped on as the fence. The adjustments are a bit ticklish, and its rather noisy. I don't think I'd want to rip strip planks with it, but it works okay for small jobs.
ken connors Posted January 27, 2004 Posted January 27, 2004 AAAAAHHHHHAAAAAA!!!!!!! so it was Simon who started this whole.......whatever this is........i always had him pegged as an instigator....... :wink:
Simon Posted January 27, 2004 Posted January 27, 2004 Hey Ken, you really don't want to make me angry man ... :twisted: :twisted: I'll come over to RI and ..... and ... where's that butt chisel .... 8) 8)
Wild_Dingo Posted January 27, 2004 Posted January 27, 2004 Well... okay a tad impassioned I became and apologize for my rather emotional outburst... apology is offered and the hand of peace outspread to all including Dave. 2 years is a long time Dave and yes its been well over that since the debarkle you talk of... the cost wasnt only in you leaving the forum which of itself a sad thing that lessened the information available to those who would learn and seek answers to their questions... but also Chris a fella in Canada who is restoring one of these schooners who left the forum due in no small part to some of your comments. Ive tried many times to apologize to you... and although you once said you accepted that I feel that somehow you havent... since I still find you dredging up that event which to me is now part of the history of learning I along with all of us must go through... I have learnt many a lesson since I started coming on this internet in search of my boating dreams and some Ive had to learn with a crashing resounding whack and yes at times with a few... but learn I do... I realized not long after that time that you were in fact right with your estimation at the time and so shelved my thoughts of the schooner until such a time when my experience knowledge and ability could fesibly achieve it and informed the forum to that fact to assague any continuing issues regarding it... maybe one day I will get to build it but then again maybe never? who knows! but one learns... Part of apologizing at least where I come from is the ability to accept it when given... and be able to continue without bringing the event up... in other words apology accepted no worries move forward maintaining perhaps a degree of caution until comfort and freindship is fully restored... or apology not accepted and a holding onto the event such as you have chosen to do. Sad fact is that I think you are a hell of a wealth of knowledge experience and skill that I for one do respect although I do perhaps sound as though I dont... Probably an Australian thing I tend not to look at any person with awe or godlike simpering... to me your just a bloke thats been fortunate enough in your time to learn what I wish to learn nothing more and nothing less... People are people Dave we all blow off we all learn and we all take our lessons and move forward and if we are lucky we are able to stay the course in friendship... and as people we all tend to make mistakes say things that we assume or suspect and as is the case with the internet often we base that on what we read and how we conscrue what is written... and hopefully we are big enough to aknowledge when we have been wrong and apologise for it... and conversely be big enough to honestly accept that apology when given... Its another part of the human condition Dave. Mike I write as I write... I dont ask any to change their method of expression or the words they use and dont change mine unless its solely for clarity but that takes time... like anyone else you can understand what I write I have always used the ... to express a pause in a paragraph or sentence... I use "strine" when I am talking because thats how I talk normally and often I talk to myself as Im writing so the "strine" just flows... Im not apologizing for either just stating its the way I write... and as you well know from your phone calls to me the way I speak is very much with an Australian accent. Some reckon Im worse tha Steve Irwin or Croc Dundee ever where... ah well such is as it is Frank I do come here occasionally as I like the comeraderie of mateship that has been created and the posts that are considerate and informative particularly about Stevensons wee boats... its quite a pleasure to relax in the quiet zone you have created... and I do apologize for the intemperate remarks of my previous post.
Greg Luckett Posted January 27, 2004 Posted January 27, 2004 I do perhaps sound as though I dont... Probably an Australian thing I tend not to look at any person with awe or godlike simpering... to me your just a bloke thats been fortunate enough in your time to learn what I wish to learn nothing more and nothing less....Not just an Australian thing. Being from Texas and having spent time with the Ausie Navy, lots of folks here share the Australians' attitudes. You folks are the closest I have found to share the same values and behaviors as Texans.
Wild_Dingo Posted January 27, 2004 Posted January 27, 2004 Interesting!!! Ive always considered that we Aussies are most similar to the Canadians :? Must get to meet some Texans in person one day... the only Americans Ive met in person have been a couple from New York a fella from Seattle an interesting girl from San Fransisco :twisted: a couple of totally troppo buggars from a place called something or other that I cant remember in Michagan... we are excused from remembering the particular place due to an excessive amount of imbibing of the amber fluid of the gods and some wakky tabbakky that didnt stop so I dont remember a whole lot about that particular week in Darwin :oops:
Tom Holder Posted January 27, 2004 Posted January 27, 2004 Speaking as a Canadian who's been to Oz and to Texas, I'd have to say that Dingos and Wolves are more of a type than Dingos and Armadillos. Of course, I've only been in big-city Texas so my experience may be somewhat limited.
Dave Fleming Posted January 27, 2004 Author Posted January 27, 2004 Ah well life is....life, I guess. First, I am NO God or know-it-all nor 'Esteemed Expert' period. What I am, is some one who has spent a little time doing certain things and based on that emperical knowledge and experience make comments or observations about a particular thing. Nothing more nothing less. Most certainly there are many ways to do a thing, some good some bad, some elegant some crude, some fast some slow. ALL will get the job done, the difference is to the eye and pocket book and finished product. Shane to me, is an impetious, rash, emotional fellow with almost no boat building knowledge or experience. He dreams as we all do and, perhaps he will someday build his Murray Peterson Schooner. I have no axe to grind nor grudge to hold. I simply have put him In Coventry. I wish him well and that is that. I APPLAUD those of you who perservere and diligently work towards your boat building goals. AND if along the way something I might say eases the path all the better, for both of us. After some little time in the craft one builds up a stock of memories and impressions of the goings on in boatbuilding land. From the multi-million dollar creations to the humble skiff built in the old chicken coop out back, from the ones that again, perservere to the ones whose ambition and dreams are much bigger than their skill set or pocketbook. In My Opinionated Opinion, that fellow Chris was one of the latter. Most definitely I was frank almost brutal in my assesment of what was needed to restore his dream of a vessel. BUT it was the truth and I was the only one who took the time to speak about the negatives whilst all others were oh'ing and ah'ing about what a neat boat and wishing him well. Now some time after the incident in question he returned to the WB Forums and admitted he is in over his head in more ways than one. New family=drain on the pocket book. Charlitan of a shipwright hired to do some important structural work abscounds with money and timber=upset and disillusionment. Loss of site to work=frantic scramble to find a new one but no money to do same. It pains me to say it but I truly doubt if that vessel will ever be restored. This is not a new thing for me to see. The backyards, farm yards, pastures, back corners of boat yards and marinas are filled with crashed dreams of abandoned vessels, half built or half restored. Sorry thing to see and one can speculate on the negative effect in personal lives of such too. All those ferro cement hulls left leaning against that pasture oak or full of birds nests in the back barn. A twice old runabout with the stem slowly giving in to gravity and no fasteners in the corner of a marina these are images in my mind. Sad so sad. A fact that it is very hard to grasp for most people, is that a rebuild, a restoration, call it what you will, actually takes more time and money than a new build! And to be attemping such a task without a realistic view or plan is folly of the worst kind. We are talking ***thousands*** of man hours here for a large project say 40 or so feet. With 2000 man hours as a rule of thumb calculation for a work year. Then the space and the MONEY lots of it. Keep those feet firmly on the ground people, folla? Not much more to say on this sorry situation. I do hope you all can understand my views NOT asking for agreement just understanding. PAX
Guest Posted January 27, 2004 Posted January 27, 2004 Not a problem here, Dave. I conveyed basically the same thoughts over there, on a new thread as to my exact feelings, down in boat related. I will leave it over there, and I am done on this topic. Thanks.
Wild_Dingo Posted January 27, 2004 Posted January 27, 2004 Ah well life is....life' date=' I guess.Shane to me, is an impetious, rash, emotional fellow with almost no boat building knowledge or experience. He dreams as we all do and, perhaps he will someday build his Murray Peterson Schooner. I have no axe to grind nor grudge to hold. I simply have put him In Coventry. I wish him well and that is that. [/quote'] ah well I had hoped that by again apologizing all this could be behind us... Tis a fine line of words there Dave... you wish me well and say you have no axe to grind yet cannot address yourself to me when you talk of me? even knowing I am here following this thread?... to be ignored by one who cannot accept a given apology? to be ignored by one who deems to talk of one in the second person?... I have been put into Coventry and become a non entity to such a one as this? Whether or not I am a: "impetious, rash, emotional fellow with almost no boat building knowledge or experience" would seem to be rather irrelevent when Ive admitted being so for some 3 years and inexperience can only be gained by doing and learning and asking questions boat building knowledge by the same route. When I read such as that and the self gratifying statements about Chris who could not possibly have known the troubles that came along as none do know what lays just beyond the next corner in life... Such words as "pompus ass" come to mind Dave but be that as it may... you deem to refuse yet again my honest apology and choose ignorantly to treat me with contempt by talking about me in the second person bring that term to even greater strength. Some would say that for a grown man with such "emperical knowledge and experience" as you profess to hold a thing such as a thread on an internet forum against a person for over 2 years is the height of foolishness. Enough... I am done with you and attempting to soothe the waters so that the lines of communication can be reopened... Such is life.
Frank Hagan Posted January 28, 2004 Posted January 28, 2004 I think all that can be said has been said, so I'm closing this topic.
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