Abyssdncr Posted January 11, 2016 Posted January 11, 2016 About half way through a stitch & glue build, I just ordered plans and materials for a Tadploe. Never tried SOF before, but looking forward to the similarities to my model airplane building experiences. With a wife and a few kids, no doubt the Tadpole should find someone to claim it as their own. Couple questions in the meantime: 1) What are the frames made from - laminated 1/2" to 1" thick or 3/4" ply? 2) What is the anticipated overall finished weight? (Really hoping it's light enough for the daughter to lug to the lake herself...) 3) What is the anticipated build time for a newbie? (Getting really tired of wasting legitimate weekend build time waiting for the next batch of epoxy to cue with this S&G build...) Thanks! Quote
Abyssdncr Posted January 12, 2016 Author Posted January 12, 2016 Spent about an hour and a half scouring Home Depot for decent wood tonight, not that I really know what I'm looking for... I think it might be easier to find a virgin worth marrying than a clean straight grained knot free piece of red cedar at a LLS. Ended up coming home with an interesting hodge-podge of 2x2x8, 2x6x10, and a mostly good 2x4x8 of rough cut that ought to clean up ok. Gonna start with the FreeB, I think. Started drafting up the frames tonight. Figure I'll wait til I get the gunwales, keel, and stringers scarfed before I finish the patterns so I know exactly how big the notches should be. I have a couple 2'x6' standard EAA work tables that I can repurpose for the strongback, at least that's the plan. Tomorrow evening is pretty packed though, so I don't know if I'll be able to figure out much tomorrow, bit by bit though, right? Quote
Rich D Posted January 12, 2016 Posted January 12, 2016 Maybe I can help a little bit with your questions. I have not yet built from Jeff's plans but I have built several fuselage style boats. 1. The frames and stem pieces are made from 1/2" ply. I have never seen a need to double them up except for on my current build i did double the frame member that is just in front of the cockpit because i enlarged the opening to make room for my big feet and by doing that I lessened the amount of wood remaining for frame strength. 2. I would expect your finished weight to be close to 25 - 30 lbs. 3. Lots of people will ask how long it took to build your boat. I usually say 'all winter', or 'all year' in the case of a cedar strip. A SOF could probably be built in 4 days of steady work, not counting the painting. Or maybe 4 weekends. It all depends. But, unlike many other methods of building, there is not much wait time needed between building steps. Good idea to wait on the stringer notches until your stringers are cut. After milling my gunwales and stringers I just cut off a few inches from one piece to trace around to mark my notches on the frames. Around here a good source for plywood is Menards. There recently started carrying Marine Ply at about $50 a sheet. It will take less that 1/2 sheet for most boats. Not an inexpensive way to get clear cedar but Home Depot carries 2x2 cedar in 8' lengths. Most pieces are entirely clear with good straight grain. Many of the 2x's will have some nice dark color to them also, which doesn't matter in SOF building but is useful at times for other work. Quote
Abyssdncr Posted January 12, 2016 Author Posted January 12, 2016 Thanks Rich, I see where I misinterpreted the plans calling for the frames ti be a minimum of 1" thick. Those $7 2x2s are what I got 4 of...ouch. I don't know why, but I didn't even think about Menards. I'll try to take a peek in there over lunch. Quote
Rich D Posted January 12, 2016 Posted January 12, 2016 About 1 out of every 10 searches thru the lumber piles at Menards I can find 1 or 2 'mostly clear' cedar boards. Except for the 2x2's at HD that is my most reliable source. I pick up a board now and then just to have a supply on hand. Quote
Action Tiger Posted January 12, 2016 Posted January 12, 2016 If you are limited to box stores, you have to pick and dig. And, be creative. Fascia boards are almost always passable SPF, and are 2 by 6 or 8. Decking and fencing material are also good sources. Ditto stair tread and riser stock. If you dig, restack your stack. Shop often, as they go through stuff quick. Dig, dig, dig... Deck material is often cedar or redwood, as is fencing stuff. Surely there are decks and fences there, someone who builds them, or has a yard? That guy probably wants to get rid of some dry stock... Try to find a local lumberyard and find out what they like to be bribed with. Buy some stuff, get known a little, drop some donuts on them, and, WHAM! stuff starts getting culled for you... Find a tree trimmer in your area. You might could get hooked up with some custom cut wood... I always try to buy the widest stock possible, because I like to imagine it came from a more mature tree. Always check the grain, though, and keep those rings close! Quote
Abyssdncr Posted January 13, 2016 Author Posted January 13, 2016 Got the stringer stock ripped tonight. Sadly, my table saw-fu isn't impressive, but I ought to be able to get them cleaned up alright. Pretty sure I understand the purpose of a power planer now though... Need to figure out the scarfing business now. Is it better to scarf in the middle, toward an end, or does it even matter? Tadpole plans & materials and the SEA-LECT hatch cover for the Wood Duck show up tomorrow, so happy days! Quote
Action Tiger Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Table saws are only as good as their tables, so rig up a pair of rollers, at least, and use a good, long fence, and feather boards. The scarf will be a little stiffer than the surrounding wood, so try to keep them out of real curvy parts, or they might make an ugly unfair spot. On these boats, they tend to kind of work out towards the end I suppose, depending on your stock, which is probably best. A good scarf will be plenty strong, though, no matter where you put it. Just not ON a frame... Quote
Abyssdncr Posted January 14, 2016 Author Posted January 14, 2016 Table saws are only as good as their tables, so rig up a pair of rollers, at least, and use a good, long fence, and feather boards. Wow, a feather board...that would have been useful yesterday.... Dang USPS dropped then ball on both my deliveries today, but it did give me the opportunity to focus on scarfing tonight. All the longerons are acarfed together now, but there's stil a lot od sanding and planing left to do to square everything up. I didn't fully appreciate all that I didn't know until starting this, but I suppose that's part of the process, right? Got the frames all drawn tonight, and had a kiddo start the bow and stern loft drafts tonight, Hopefully I'll have something lashed soon! Quote
andy00 Posted January 14, 2016 Posted January 14, 2016 Scarf joints are a great way to joint two short boards to create a longer board. But there is an alternative that has a long history in boat building and has some advantages; i.e., butt blocks. This method of joining is quicker and easier, since it is accomplished with simple square cuts. It requires no table saw or jigs. While one can cut scarfs with handsaws and planes, there is quite a bit more time and fitting to get a good joint. With epoxy glue, a butt block will be stronger than the stick, especially for the small sticks used for kayak longitudinals. Since longitudinal members on a kayak don't curve that much, sticks with butt blocks still take fair curves and don't display "flat spots." You do have to plan so that the blocks end up between frames. On my SOF boat, I used blocks about 7" long and positioned those on the chine logs and gunwales in the forward part of the cockpit. On the keel, I used two blocks, one on each side a bit further forward. I'm not sure that this symmetry was necessary, but it felt right. Everything looks fine and performs perfectly. Fair winds to all, Andy Quote
Abyssdncr Posted January 15, 2016 Author Posted January 15, 2016 Well, another hiccup today. While researching various plywood recommendations, I found out that the sheet of plywood I got from Home Depot, while very pretty, is made from CA approved eco friendly hippie glue and delaminates quickly in wet conditions... Special order Baltic on order from Menards. On the bright side, that should cover both the Tadpole and the FreeB. I am getting all the stringers cleaned up in the mean time. Probably need to shave down the gunwales a smidge more as they're still 13/16" wide and quite stiff by comparison to the other stringers. I plan to use the stiffer stock cut from the rough cedar board for the keel and the $7 Home Depot offerings for the chine stringers and deck ridge. The 2x6 yielded the gunwales in 13' lengths once the knots were all sawn around with the scarfs in symmetric locations. I did my scarfs at 8 degrees with a quickie jig on my chop saw. Perhaps not quite as shallow of an angle as what I've seen recommended, but it certainly was easy and appears to have done the job quite nicely. I really hope Menards moves faster than the USPS though, because my order from Jeff that was supposed to show up yesterday still didn't show up today... . With Monday being a freebie from work, I was really hoping to have some progress before the weekend was up. However, the Hatch for the Wood Duck did show up, so at least I can get that one moving forward again. 1 Quote
Abyssdncr Posted January 15, 2016 Author Posted January 15, 2016 Table saws are only as good as their tables, so rig up a pair of rollers, at least, and use a good, long fence, and feather boards. Mag switch feather board shows up Saturday courtesy of Amazon. Quote
Action Tiger Posted January 16, 2016 Posted January 16, 2016 I cannot imagine one place on a Kudzu boat I would use a butt block. Quote
Abyssdncr Posted January 25, 2016 Author Posted January 25, 2016 So, genius me orders a mag switch feather board for a saw with an aluminum table... Quote
Abyssdncr Posted January 27, 2016 Author Posted January 27, 2016 No progress tonight, but got a smidge of progress in last night. The daughter that "promised" she'd help finally showed up in the shop. Got her running a couple frames through the router and cleaning up the cuts with some 60 grit. 3 more frames and 2 more coaming pieces to go before we can put the jigsaw away. Quote
Abyssdncr Posted March 31, 2016 Author Posted March 31, 2016 Still no more progress on the actual boat, but perhaps the most important part of the project got accomplished last night. Life jackets showed up in yesterday's mail. I tried mine on, adjusted it, hung it in the closet, and went to gather the cane pole and worms. I managed to get one bluegill before she showed up on the bank, life jacket on, giving me puppy dog eyes... She's had one prior paddling experience at a summer camp in a canoe, but nothing in a kayak before. So, back to the shore I went. Got her in, adjusted the foot rests, and gave it a shove out into the water. After about 10 minutes of slow deliberate experimentation, she disappeared across the lake. I should have brought a lawn chair... 45 minutes of forward, backward, circles, leaning, deep strokes, shallow strokes, sprints, glides...I get my boat back, and she just giggles around the house for another hour. I think she's hooked, and I better get to ripping some stringers! Quote
Abyssdncr Posted April 4, 2016 Author Posted April 4, 2016 Got the brackets cut, leveled, and mounted on the work table(s), stringers and gunwales ripped, and started lashing a couple frames to the keel. Pretty sure I got lucky with the lumber and will get away without having to do any scarfs. We'll see how the week goes, but I might have a FROG by the weekend! Quote
Abyssdncr Posted April 5, 2016 Author Posted April 5, 2016 Got the deck and keel all lashed in except for the bracket locations, chine stringers sanded, routed, cut, fit, and zip tied in. The kiddo even lashed her first knot tonight...and I found time for a couple laps around the lake tonight. Not a bad evening! Junky weather tomorrow, so hopefully I'll have the rest of the stringers lashed and the gunwales zipped on by the end of tomorrow. Need to cut the seat slats tomorrow too. Think I'll put the girl to work finishing the slats prior to installation and sand away on the coaming til her arms ache while I work the joint lashings. Made a mistake though, not paying attention to reading the instructions... I wondered what all those screw locations were for, and then just pressed on sanding off the templates and gluing all the plywood coaming rings together. Guess this one will just be stitched in place instead of the 2-piece install, which is too bad as I was really looking forward to trying that method once I saw how it is supposed to work. Next one maybe... Quote
Abyssdncr Posted April 6, 2016 Author Posted April 6, 2016 Chine stringers lashed in but for the little frames at each end. Gunwales sanded, routed, zipped on, and fit. Got two lashings on before running out of steam for the night. Need more sinew... Quote
Hirilonde Posted April 6, 2016 Posted April 6, 2016 That is the snazziest strong back I have seen yet! The frame is looking good too. Quote
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