Blog for my BRS 17' build

[sscoville]

I just started a blog to document the build of my BRS 17' (Hull # 134).  If you're interested, it can be found here: http://brs-pelican.blogspot.com/

[Guest wwbaginski]

wow, it's a  a perfect job! I think I started my boat the same time last year...  Your place looks interesting too - looks like you can use daylight as long as possible. I was trying to post a comment, but it's not easy.

[sscoville]

I have one light and I use I headlamp when I need to.  I have a florescent light I've been meaning to put up.  It should make a world of difference because the one light I have is pretty dim.

[sscoville]

I'm at the point where I've cut my bottom panels roughly to shape.  http://brs-pelican.blogspot.com/  I'm wondering the procedure for epoxying the panels to the keelson.  I was thinking I could just put a healthy layer of thickened epoxy on the keelson and then screw the panels onto it temporarily.  If I don't put enough, however, I could end up with gaps that I either won't know about or can't access later.  If I put too much, I could end up with bunch of rock hard mess on the inside bottom to deal with.

What's the protocol here?  I have shaped the keelson some so that there is pretty good surface to surface contact between it and the panels.

[Tom Lathrop]

I'm at the point where I've cut my bottom panels roughly to shape.  http://brs-pelican.blogspot.com/  I'm wondering the procedure for epoxying the panels to the keelson.  I was thinking I could just put a healthy layer of thickened epoxy on the keelson and then screw the panels onto it temporarily.  If I don't put enough, however, I could end up with gaps that I either won't know about or can't access later.  If I put too much, I could end up with bunch of rock hard mess on the inside bottom to deal with.

What's the protocol here?  I have shaped the keelson some so that there is pretty good surface to surface contact between it and the panels.

It depends on how good your bevel on the keelson is.  If its good, then you should not need a lot of epoxy.  I buy glue spreaders at Ace Hardware (about 40 cents each) with graduated notches on all four sides for spreading glue.  With this spreader, its easy to get a uniform amount of epoxy spread out.  You can use a scrap piece of ply to determine how much glue you need.  Don't forget to clean the spreader like I do about half the time.

[sscoville]

I glued the second bottom panel to the keelson yesterday and flipped the boat today.  I then discovered that my center frame is off center by about a 1/4 inch - the distance between the keelson and one chine is 9/16 more than the same measurement on the other side.  And, I can clearly see the center frame is off to one side of the keelson.  I haven't glued the chines yet, so I'm hoping I haven't ruined the entire project.  Pictures can be seen at my blog - I haven't figured out how to post them here.  Any suggestions will be much appreciated.

[Ken_Potts]

   That could be a difference in bottom panels or it could be a bend in the keelson.  I'm not going to give you advice but I will tell you what I think I would do in your situation.

   If the bottom panels fit the chines and the keelson well I would forge ahead.  I'd probably spend one entire evening trying to figure out where the difference creeped in.  I'd measure the distance between the edges of the keelson and the chines.  I'd also crawl under the boat and measure the width of the bottom panels at several points along the bottom.  Those measurements would tell me if I've got bottom panels that don't match or if I've simply got a keelson that's a bit curved (the bottom panels still might be symmetrical even if the keelson has moved a bit).  If I could figure out where the problem occurred that would be great, if not I'd keep building with a note in the back of my mind that I should find something other than the keelson to use as a reference when measuring (I'd rely on level and plumb when necessary, rather than measuring to a centerline).

   I think I'd end up with a boat that sails just fine.

   I hope the folks with more experience and expertise than I have (Tom, Graham?) will correct me if I'm off-base on this one but I think I'd rather forge ahead than have to rip the bottom panels and keelson off and start over again.

   That's just me, though.  If the knowledge that the keelson is off center is going to eat at you every time you see somebody looking at your boat you might want to back up a few steps and try to fix things.  It's a personal decision and the goal of the whole process is to have a boat you love.  I love Southbound, warts and all.

   When I first turned my boat over I was absolutely horrified to discover that the keel was a little hogged.  I weighed my options - The side and bottom panels were already solidly fixed in their final state and any repair would probably involve rebuilding eveything I had done so far.  I worked my way through the despair over the next day or two measuring and staring and drinking beer (good beer) but I eventually resolved to move forward and never, ever, tell anybody what I had done.  So far I haven't had anybody look at my boat and say "looks like the keel's hogged".  If I ever do hear that phrase I plan to say "Yep - Improves her light-air performance"  ;D  I looked and stared and measured long enough that I think I know where my mistakes are.  All that really matters is that I think I know what I did wrong. 

   Oh yeah - Please don't tell anybody about my keel.

[Ken_Potts]

  I don't know why nobody else has offered any help here yet.

  Now that I've re-read your blog post I think you've got a straight boat and a bent keelson, but I'm not up on the differences in construction between the BRS and the CS.  If I'm correct you should be able to accommodate for it without ripping anything apart.  By now you've probably taken more measurements and are happily building away again but you've still got my attention.  How are things going?

[sscoville]

Thanks Ken.  I took a day to think about the whole thing before adding any glue, like you suggested.  I took the temporary fasteners out of the chine in that area and by pulling the center frame over I was able to get the difference down to 1/4 of an inch.  Much further and I end up with a large gap in my chine because I had cut the bottom panels to fit.  The 1/4 inch I can live with, I think (1/8 off center).  I started working on the centerboard trunk in the mean time.  I haven't gotten the glass I ordered from B&B yet so I haven't glued the chines.  I might go ahead and tab glue it though.

I haven't determined for sure where the error occurred.  I'm going to keep working on the center board stuff, maybe start the rudder, scarf some stringers and other things.  Maybe in the mean time I'll find a way to get it perfect.  It might just be that the center frame needs to move over an additional 1/8.  The way it is now, I'm already going to have to do some filler work on the outside of the chine, but the bottom panel at least partly rest on the side panel.  Over another 1/8 and the bottom no longer rests on the side at that spot. 

[Tom Lathrop]

I didn't see you problem earlier but here is how I keep my boats straight.  I stretch a string centerline under the boat or mold as soon as it is started.  Mark any bulkheads or frames that cross the boat or mold on their centers.  Usually, this calls for a V notch cut in mold pieces to clear the stretched line.  Any time you do more work or additions on one side than the other, it's likely that the boat will be drawn a bit off center.  Chine logs or any other member on either side can be more less stiff and move  off center also.  Just a glance at the line each day will tell you how it's going and it's easy to keep straight if you keep up with it. 

[Designer]

Sam,

It looks like you are getting it straight.

I did not know you were waiting on glass tape. I can get it out to you today if you can get up with me.

[Ken_Potts]

Sam, I thought you had already glued things up  - I'm glad you've been able to adjust things to straighten it out a bit.

[tom151]

I haven't determined for sure where the error occurred.  The way it is now, I'm already going to have to do some filler work on the outside of the chine, but the bottom panel at least partly rest on the side panel.  Over another 1/8 and the bottom no longer rests on the side at that spot.

Perhaps you can reduce the angst if you consider that you have "two" boats -- one being the 'inside' boat (the interior furniture) -- the other being the 'outside' boat (the shape that the water sees).

You certainly want the 'outside' shape to be as uniform to the water flow (equal with respect to shape port and starboard). Particularly if you have a skeg, you'll want to make sure it is dead straight and not inadvertantly made to follow a/the seam between bottom panels (which may not be straight) -and- to be equidistant between the chines if possible.

As far as the 'inside' boat - IMNSHO it really doesn't matter if the furniture is slightly off center. Certainly not if it requires ripping stuff out!

My 2 cents,

TomH

[sscoville]

I thought you had already glued things up

I have not glued the chines.  The keelson is glued and the forward bulkhead, transom, stem.  TomH's point makes a lot of sense.  I would not think 1/8 of an inch would create a problem with the lineup of the centerboard, masts, etc.  I still have some things to play out in my head before I start gluing the chines.  I've definitely decided I won't be tearing anything apart.

[sscoville]

I am about to cut out the pieces for my centerboard trunk.  From the plans and photos I've seen, it appears that one side has a handle like piece on it, but the other does not.  Can someone explain this?  Does this attach in some way to the forward thwart?

[Ken_Potts]

  The handle-like piece ends up being framing for the forward seat.  It runs all the way up to the seat framing on the forward bulkhead.

  One thing I didn't do when I installed my CB trunk was put a temporary block inside the the trunk at the bottom to make sure the middle of the CB slot was the same width as the ends.  I didn't think of it so I just measured everything very, very carefully.  Then it ended up pinched in a bit and I had to reshape the CB to fit it.  It was agonizing work.  Make sure the temporary filler piece is a little wider than the CB (same width as the fore and aft pieces of the trunk) and you're good to go.

[sscoville]

When is the temporary center frame removed?  I just finished gluing in my side stringers and I've filleted and glassed the chines.  Do I need to install the inwhales and side frames first?