Launching day of FreeAtLast, with capsize

[Knut]

On the third trip out on Biscayne Bay with Bob Cox onboard we enjoyed very pleasant conditions and very nice sailing. This was when I really relaxed and enjoyed it all in full. That was also when I suddenly found out that I come from keel-boat sailing and that the Weekender takes training and experience from dinghy sailing. I managed to swamp the boat!

I have been brooding about it since Friday and now, finally, it is on sufficient distance that I can expose my mistake on the forum. An account written and sent to Dale Collins on Saturday gives the story as it felt the day after:

Dale,

I don't know if you heard about it already, but after you left Bob and myself went out alone. We started out like the round you went on but we aimed for Key Biscayne. Wind was about the same or may be slightly more and we were making good pace. A little further direction Key Biscayne than where we turned left on your trip, Bob went up on the foredeck in front of the mast to tighten up the jib halyard. When he was up there and occupied with the rope we got a minor gust that started heeling us a bit more over and I was not at all concerned until I realized that the heeling did not stop. I tried to turn into the wind but got a surprising lack of response from the rudder and before I got as far as thinking about letting out on the main-sheet, we went over all the way and got completely swamped.

Because of this, my camera and both of Bob's (as we both stupidly enough brought the cameras onboard) were submerged and all pictures lost. The batch from you is therefore a fantastic gift and I cannot express how thankful I am that you were NOT in the boat with us (with camera)! A million thanks for the whole lot; on the water pictures we can always get later. The Launch pictures are unique and cannot be re-made!!!

A real Gentleman in a bassboat came to our rescue about 5 minutes after we swamped. Without extra floatation installed it was quite easy to right her (after releasing the halyards and pulling the sails down), but it was impossible to get anywhere with bailing. The waves went in as fast as we could get any water out. The guy with the bassboat had the idea that he could pull us fast enough that water would flow out over the stern and that we could bail after that, but he would have had to have 200 hp or more and I still don't think that would have worked out. So, he towed us to a sandbar to the North and we bailed her, got the sails up, walked her out to sufficient depth for the rudder to go down and we sailed back to Matheson Hammock and landed on sail with no problem. Getting her on the trailer went like silk.

Back home I had several hours work with the fresh-water hose, another round of bailing out the fresh-water and mopping up the rest and sand and other dirt. Cleaning out the toolbox, clothing, carpet etc etc. + submerging the outboard in freshwater and rinse it off at the end by hosing it vigorously. After dark I was literally finished and could conclude before I fell asleep that camera and pictures, cellphone and some minor items were my losses. (Not counting a nasty blow to my personal pride and prestige!). Worse is that Bob lost two cameras and a cellphone. Still, he took it as the positive guy he is and he was as helpful a shipmate as anyone can ever wish to be in a boat with. Thanks Bob.

Today I have aired and cleaned the boat inside by moving around an air-blower (even operating through the night). I cannot detect any damage so far, only the small patches of untreated plywood on the inside of the cabin bulkhead had swelled somewhat in the surface. This won't even show after a little sanding and painting. The outboard I also got running tonight, after a systematic emptying and cleaning of the gas system (got the water out). So I am soon ready to sail again.

What I learned? The rudder had released at some stage. I don't know if this was after the fact (because that is when I saw it), but if it was before, it could have been the reason for the lack of rudder response when I wanted to turn into the wind. The jam-cleat on the main-sheet I can release in a fraction of a second by a single jank in the free end. However, this device I am going to consider very carefully in the future because it takes a specific action and if I get distracted by anything else (like the mentioned lack of rudder response) I may not get around to do it. With a larger jib (which is cleated) the immediate letting out or release of the main sheet will sometimes be even more important than with the standard jib.

Finally, I have been thinking about one thing that can also have contributed. It is a theory, but I feel it makes sense and it is of course not even the slightest hint that Bob should have known or foreseen or expected (I did not myself until afterwards and I may be wrong). In any case the whole thing was my mistake and responsibility. My thinking is that Bob was located on the forward side of the mast. His point of gravity was less than a foot from where the bottom hits the stem and I did notice that we dipped the bow down noticeably. That is quite logical because the footprint of the bottom is very small this far forward and the bow must drop a bit before the hull sides will contribute any lift. In this position (bow down and stern 'up') my gut feeling is that the center of uplift has moved forward where the bottom and hull-sides are narrower and the righting moment consequently is less. I don't think we tipped so much forward that this alone should influence the efficiency of the rudder, but when we start heeling the efficiency will reduce faster than with a better boat balance. The bow down position could have contributed to the very nasty feeling I remember so vividly that we are heeling and then a little more and more and it feels like there is no resistance and we just continue all the way over. And, the wind was not any stronger than before. When I said "gust", that was an exaggeration. This experience does not tie in at all with what I have read about people sailing on the hull sides for half the day, without capsizing (with a Weekender).

I have not discussed this with Bob, but I am certainly interested in any view you may have on the above. I think also that I am going to re-start my considerations about how to make a real light-weight mast. In itself the mast was not the cause, but when you get beyond about 15 degrees of heel it starts contributing in the wrong direction.

Again, thanks for coming and for such priceless pictures.

Best regards

Knut

In retrospect, after having also discussed it with Bob Cox, we agreed that another quite likely factor played a part. We where going pretty high up in the wind with the lapper jib and the mainsail close hauled and with a heel angle of normal 10 to 15 degrees. So why did we suddenly go over when we both agreed that the wind was not suddenly gusting harder? May be because of a wind-shift to a broader reach (and I did certainly not notice if that were the case). This could explain that an attempt to change course to right the boat felt as if it was too slow to really count, and only letting up on the mainsheet would have given immediate release.

Unfortunately, we could not find the flight recorder and when things go bad so fast it is very difficult to analyze afterwards exactly what and how it happened. If this experience and the way we have tried to look into factors can be of any help for others, then it was worth it. After some time (100 years or so!) this is going to be the most funny part of the whole boating experience.

Tips, viewpoints, constructive or destructive criticisms; anything will be received and considered!

[Frank Hagan]

What I learned? The rudder had released at some stage. I don't know if this was after the fact (because that is when I saw it)' date=' but if it was before, it could have been the reason for the lack of rudder response when I wanted to turn into the wind. The jam-cleat on the main-sheet I can release in a fraction of a second by a single jank in the free end. However, this device I am going to consider very carefully in the future because it takes a specific action and if I get distracted by anything else (like the mentioned lack of rudder response) I may not get around to do it. With a larger jib (which is cleated) the immediate letting out or release of the main sheet will sometimes be even more important than with the standard jib.[/quote']

First, thanks for sharing your experience, as it helps the rest of us as we analyze what happened. After we ended up on the rocks in our harbor, I was pretty philosophical about it, but it did wound my pride quite a bit. I had to admit "captain's error". But I learned from it.

I think you probably have it right ... the extra weight forward, a rudder popping up (hey, it floats!) and then not being able to release the main sheet quickly all probably contributed to it. I never have liked the main sheet jam cleats on such a small boat ... seems to invite situations where you won't react in time. At least with the slight weatherhelm the Weekender has (shared with all sloops), if you release the main sheet you usually head up into the wind. Its easier to release than to remember to jerk the main sheet sharply, in the right direction to loose it.

But to be honest, with the weight up that far forward, you may have gone over even with the rudder down or the main sheet released. There's usually a lot of factors involved in each one of these. And swamping the boat has been one of my major concerns from the start.

BTW - you mention that it righted pretty easily without flotation ... do you have the standard boat without any extra flotation? Did she float with the deck barely above water (which has been my suspicion of how she would react when completely swamped ... wood floats).

[Knut]

Frank wrote:

BTW - you mention that it righted pretty easily without flotation ... do you have the standard boat without any extra flotation? Did she float with the deck barely above water (which has been my suspicion of how she would react when completely swamped ... wood floats).

With two persons standing on the keel (mast in the water, flat and sails down) it was not difficult to right her. However, the tendency was that she would go over again if not at least one person would hang on the railing on the upwind side. That makes it additionally difficult to achieve anything when trying to bail. This is with a standard Weekender without any extra floatation and you are right, the deck was awash in the water surface, about.

One thing that I am going to do is to add floatation behind the seat backs, in the bow and probably under the deck in the cabin. The bottom of the cabin could also be a candidate. I will also insert a light weight section in the mast from just above the hinge to just below the hardware in the top. I am not aiming for a repetition, but if it is not too windy and wavy and it should ever happen again, I would expect to be able to bail her on the spot, especially because I have splash coamings full length (highest at the lowest point). This will add a lot to my comfort level, because we cannot expect every time to get a real Gentleman and seaman showing up after 5 minutes and being self-sufficient is always better than being dependant.

Also, the hole in the transom (for the tiller stump) can be well sealed off by a leather or rubber pouch (or whatever you will name) like you have around the gear stick in a car. It must not be absolutely water tight, but must allow bailing being faster than in-leakage through the opening.

More work coming my way, but sailing will be part of the program even before all this has been done!!

[Tim Diebert]

Great story for us Knut...not so great for you.

Between you, Frank and Ray I figure you have determined the cause(s).

Like you, I came from keelboat country to the Weekender. It was bloody hard to get used to! Now I am completely comfortable with the boat, though you never loose that slightly nervous aspect of being on an unballasted 'dingy'-like boat.

Good to know at least these things stay afloat. You got to be the one to test for us all. Ray thanks you (I tried to talk him into doing it a while back)

I like your input on the lighter mast. The masts on these things are huge! As far as I can tell...waaaay bigger than they need to be. I am about to put another mast togther for my boat and had intended to make something a tad lighter myself.

Rays advice of never cleating the main in air over 6 kts or so is very good. I found myself doing that pretty well automatically after the first sail or two.

If your buggering along nicely in a good stiffy and you are getting occasional gusts (God I love that feeeling) if you keep the main sheet in your hand, without touching anything else or moving your body weight...even just moving your whole arm a few inches, without letting the sheet slip through your fingers makes a world of difference in heel. It is immediate and very responsive. Because of this, the WE can be a handful when sailing in big stiff breezes. But I expect any small boat would be.

Another theory of mine is that many folks that sail these boats are kind of fooled into thinking a WE is more than it is. In reality it is a very small boat with big boat decks and house. Sometimes I think these folks should try and imagine sailing this boat as though it had no side decks or cabin.

That's what I do.

Another thing I might mention is your little warm water deep south incident could have been fatal in ANY other more northern water. I have no intention of capsizing my boat...I'd feeze my gronicals off!! :shock:

Sorry to hear about your camera(s) and cel phone. Bummer. :cry:

and so it goes.

[T. Nelson Surbrook]

One thing that would help prevent this from occoring again is to run all the lines aft to the cockpit. I have noticed that going forward makes the boat really tender and not going forward would be one way of reducing the chances of a repeat. I use a roller for the genoa and I don't ever go forward anymore. Old age and lazyness I think. :wink:

[Johannah]

Knut, thanks for sharing the experience because, as others have said, we all learn from such tales. I saved Frank's "on the rocks" story and will save this one since they really help me to think things through. No wonder the old salts I knew as a kid always shared such yarns, with suitable embellishments of course. Everybody knew that everyone else had broached, sunk, hit rocks, forgotten the sheet, misjudged the current, etc. And lived to tell the tale. :shock: I also am planning to add some flotation, probably canoe flotation bags to forward locker, something to under deck area (we have no seat backs). I would love to see a discussion again of more flotation possibilities as well as locations. How to add flotation to lazarette area with wheel steering?

We don't need anything fancy or even permanent to block the tiller hole in the transom, if swamped. Anything flexible enough to jam in the hole will do the trick. Teeshirts are the classic choice. A sponge would also work. We carry a plastic bucket, clorox bottle scoops, a hand pump and, of course, a sponge. Might you gather from that list that I have rolled a boat or two in my day. But I have always regretted missing the best/worse knockdown of my youth. Two college guys who crewed for me on my lightning took it out to race one day when I could not go. They wanted to see how fast they could push without conservative (read chicken) me along. Set the spinaker for the downwind leg, going great guns, slight wind shift and the spinaker pulled that baby right under. Classic broach. They arrived home wetter, wiser and eventually forgave me for crying with laughter. I still remember the sails draped all over trees in the yard. 8)

[Robert Cox]

I wasn't going to mention any of this on the forum until Knut said something first. :oops:

At this point I am no longer think of why it happen. Conclusions have been drawn. My only concern is how to get the boat bailed out after it is swamped. The Weekender is very easy to right. Just stand on the keel and over it comes. Just like any sailing dingy. The problem is getting the water out of it once it's upright. My biggest concern, the Vacationer won't be so easy to right. It's a whole lot more boat.

Without extra floatation the deck is at water line when swamped. As Knut said, the wave action filled the boat faster than we could bail, and we're only talking about 1' waves on average.

My thoughts:

The hole in the transom for the rudder tiller needs to be eliminated or sealed in some way. Dad and I had also thought of using the boot from the stick shift of a car.

If the hole in the transom is not eliminated it would be best if the waterline when swamped is below the tiller hole. The only way this will happen is if there is plenty of floatation in the boat. Floatation in the lazzerett and behind the seat backs are the most obvious locations. Of course without floatation in the bow you would end up floating bow down wich could lead to water through the forward hatch.

On our Vacationer, I plan to add a bulkhead just behind the bits. This will be a sealed compartment for one purpose only. Floatation. The area from the bits forward is unusable space in my opinion, so why not make use of it. I'm not sure if this can be done on the Weekender. There will also be foam attached to the underside of the top deck in the forward locker area.

An other area that I've thought of adding floatation is the underside of the deck in the cabin area. I may not do this but it is a possability. The one thought on this area is that it would help stabilize the boat after you get it turned over. As Knut had pointed out. One of us had to stay on one side of the boat to keep it from wanting to go back over. My thought here is that without the chines and bottom of the boat for stability the heaviest part of the boat wanted to go down. Lowering the mast would have helped here.

An obvious area of floatation is the cabin. If the hatch and hatch boards had been closed, I think the boat would have popped right back up after the knockdown. I might have been in the water but the boat would still have been floating. We might have had to bail the cockpit, but that would have probably been it.

Other possibilities abound as far as floatation. One obviouse possibiliy is the use of inflatable bladders such as those used in many dingies. One in the forward locker and one each under the seats might do the trick.

The experiance it self wasn't a bad one. If I hadn't lost almost a $1000 worth of electronic equipment it might have even been fun. That is my fault though. I should have at very least had them in plastic bags or even better, left them in the truck.

I have read of one other account of capsizing a Weekender and his experiance was much the same. He could not bail it without getting into shallow water first. The only way your going to bail a Weekender in deep water is to have floatation.

Of course the best way to keep from having to bail a Weekender is not to swamp it in the first place. I would be willing to bet that Knut never capsizes his again. Experiance is such a great educater.

Bob Cox 8)

[Johannah]

Seems like a good time to make a resolution to practice handling the boat this summer with the sails alone, not using the tiller. So resolved!

[Tim Diebert]

Just got thiss months copy of Sail magazine.

Cover article? How to make your boat unsinkable.

:shock:

Good timing for the Messin Folks!

[Knut]

Ray,

what you say about bailing difficulties is correct, especially if the waves are any larger than a foot or so (even with all sorts of passive floatation installed). In rough conditions the best bet would be as Bob suggested, to make sure all openings are properly closed and may be equipped with a little rubber packing. This in combination with a light weight mast would make it quite easy to quickly right the boat again without going overboard to do it, even if the cockpit would be filled and some liters would find its way into the cabin, lazarett etc. Bailing would then be an easy task.

The scuba-tank and inflatable bags is an interesting thought. What is the weight of such a scuba bottle and what is the price? It would also have to be within reach for release when needed and the air quantity would have to be adapted to the size of the inflatable bag, to inflate properly, but not blow it by overpressure. I also got a bit confused by the mix of cubic feet and cubic meters, which is quite a difference.

Any way, prevention is better than cure. I have already installed slab-reefing on the mainsail. Halyards for both main and jib will soon go back to the cockpit. I will also have a downhaul on the jib back to cockpit.

[Knut]

I found something called Dunnage Air bags. I have asked for prices and some other details, but you may want to have a look for yourselves:

http://www.litco.com/index.htm

:?: :?:

[Knut]

Thanks a lot for the jib Jackline tip. I think I have seen it before, but I had also forgotten about it. I like the principle better than a normal down-haul so I am going to install this and see how it works.

Have you tried it yourself? If so, what do you think about it?

[Robert Cox]

That Widget website was one I've had saved in my favorites for quite some time. Lots of good information there. The jackline/down haul set-up was one already planned for our Vacationer. Since I intend to do some solo sailing, I don't want there to be any reason to go forward. Maybe I'll incorporate roller furling/reefing in the future. At very least, I will have all lines run back to the cockpit. The cabin roof is going to get totaly coverred with lines but it will be worth it.

Knuts boat is set up very well with all lines coming to the cockpit except the jib and yoak halyards. Not two minutes before we capsized, we where discussing the need to have the jib halyard come back to the cockpit.

If I could just get the deck fiberglassed I could actually start working on some of the rigging. :wink:

Bob 8)

[Guest Brett in Bangkok]

When my Skipjack went over it was completely swamped - the deck was at water level. While I could right it there was no way I could bail either. There were two foot choppy waves also. On its side, however, half the hull was out of the water making it easy to see and to hang on to. I would be interested to hear how boats with flotation have fared after going over.

Brett

[Steve Clutterbuck]

Hi everyone,

I'm a very infrequent poster here but I lurk regularly and greatly

appreciate the shared knowledge of the regular contributors. I think it's

time I made a contribution so I would like to share the following thoughts.

Firstly thanks to you Knut for sharing you experiences. This sort of

information is invaluable for those of us who are building but have never

actually sailed a Weekender.

My sailing background is in dinghys and catamarans, in fact I have never set

foot on a keel boat. Right from the start I have regarded the Weekender as a

big dinghy and since I have managed to capsize every dinghy I have ever

raced I don't feel at all worried about it provided the boat can be righted

easily. The water here in Australia is relatively warm though so I can

understand why capsizing may be a bit more of an issue for those of you

living in cooler areas.

Knut's experience shows that righting isn't a problem but bailing is. When I

first started building my Weekender I read the previous account of a capsize

that some of you have already mentioned. It was obvious that a swamped

Weekender would sit very low in the water and would need extra flotation to

allow bailing out so I decided on a few modifications to provide some extra

flotation. My solutions may not suit everyone and in fact have yet to be

tested, but in the hope of at least throwing some more ideas into the ring

this is what I have done.

I have gone for a tiller instead of the wheel for steering. This is partly

because I like the tiller but partly because it eliminates the hole in the

transom. My tiller goes over the top of the aft deck not through the

lazarette. I have also extended the walls of the lazarette all the way to

the sides of the hull so the lazarette becomes a watertight area which

should provide plenty of flotation. To allow access for ventilation and

storage of light equipment I have made a sealed hatch cover on the aft deck.

Similarly I have sealed the front storage compartment by making a sealed

hatch for the deck and sealed covers for the access holes through the

bulkhead inside the cabin. The seat backs are sealed as usual but will have

access ports to provide ventilation.

Hopefully these three sealed areas will provide enough flotation to keep a

swamped boat high enough to allow easy bailing. In the event of a swamping I

also plan to carry some watertight storage containers so that delicate items

such as cameras etc can be kept out of harms way when not actually being

used.

I was also very interested to read peoples opinions of the weight of the

mast. I have actually been considering a sealed alloy mast but had almost

decided against it for asthenic reasons. I may have to reconsider this

though. Has anyone tried an alloy mast?

Sorry for the long post but hope I may have provided some food for thought.

Steve

[Guest Adam]

Hello all,

First time posting here, although I'm sure a few of you recognize me....

Regarding the flotation placement mentioned earlier in this thread, I don't think placing it low is going to help your boat float higher. All it will do is move the water UP, and probably make your boat even more tippy than it already will be when full of water (I intentionally swamped my weekender under semi controlled circumstances a couple of years ago, so I know how unstable it becomes).

I think the best placement would be high, so that not as much water gets in the boat in the first place. Or maybe evenly distributed along the sides.

With that said, the way I plan on adding floatation (when and if I ever get around to it), is by filling the bottom half of the lazarette with foam. It is fairly well separated from the area under the seats in my case, so I will probably just finish blocking the small areas where water can migrate and use expanding foam. This space ends up being a useless repository for junk, so I don't think I'd miss the space.

I'm also planning on lining the sides of the forepeak area with an inch or two of closed cell foam. It's tight in there, so that may be an unpleasant task. I think I will add the foam underneath the deck in that area as well, if it isn't too tricky. And if I really get motivated, and I find a deal on foam, I may line the hull sides inside the cabin. I think this would make late season overnight trips more comfortable with the added insulation.

BTW, I have taken my Weekender out in fairly severe weather (small craft advisory, 30knot+ winds according to the radio), and while it scared me a bit, especially that cold november sail when no other boats where on the Bay, by keeping ahead of the boat I was able to sail without major problems (my reef points earned their keep that day). You haven't lived until your entire foredeck is submerged in an ugly green wave one 40 degree day in November!

[Derek]

Thanks Ray for the simplicity in your last post.

Having never sailed I am following all of this carefully, but will spend a considerable amount of time getting my feet (hopefully that's about it) wet before experimenting with additional ballast vs. flotations issues, other than perhaps a battery for now.

I plan to keep this boat for some time and hopefully will recall these discussions in the future.

[Johannah]

I'm glad this thread popped up again. I have been noodling around with a "drill" to use when capsized. How about working out a general plan together so those new to sailing have some systematic directions for practice flips or accidental? I will post a starter list soon but jump on in with any thoughts.

[Derek]

Johannah, great thought. Never have sailed before and looking forward to it, but definitely be good to have some 'systematic directions ' just in case.

[Frank Hagan]

Ray has a good start on the list. Here's my addition, based on conversations with those that have capsized:

The sail will "stick" to the water once the boat is over on its side. This will make it very hard to pull the boat back upright with the sail unfurled, and also provides an easy way for another gust to push the boat back over mid-way. If the sheets are cleated, loose them. If you can get to the throat and peak halyards, loosen them and bring the gaff down to the boom, gathering the sail between them. Some have disconnected the forestay and pulled the mast pin or otherwise folded the mast to make it easier.

Any of you guys with experience in this speak up!