Mast hoops

[timnphx]

I purchased 6 of the 4-inch white oak mast hoops from Pert Lowell Co. and ended up just setting them in a drawer cause I didn't like the way they looked. They were the copper riveted ones, but what i didn't like was they were thin wood wrapped around a few turns to form the hoop but they had separations in the wraps. it was like splitting at parts on almost each hoop so didn't use them. I haven't yet figured out what i will use them for as was a waste of $70 I think. I went with an external SS slide. Not as nice as something wooden on my wooden mast but actually more effective I think since I will have a sprit pole there as well that i think would be more interfering if had hoops. I do think the hoops at Sailrite might be better quality but not certain.

Tim

[capt jake]

I lookilng at the Sailrite hoops on-line, they appear to be Pert hoops. At least to my eye.

[timnphx]

Yes I agree, The photos at Sailrite do look like they could be Pert Co. hoops. Pert Co. has the 4 inch for $11.50 each where Sailrite for 4 inch is $23.95. But I must say I have good customer service with Sailrite. I got my mainsail kit and jib kits and several other parts from them and I am a happy customer. I sent my sail demensions and designs to them and the quote I got held up for about 2 years befor I finally forked over the money and purchased them. I enjoyed sewing them up too even though my wife about had a fit each time I was seen using her sewing machine to sew them.

Tim

[Barry Pyeatt]

I've seen a few of the Pert lowell hoops and yes, they are simply 2 1/2 - 3 wraps of steamed wood with copper rivets in them. Then treated with hot boiled linseed oil. Those that I've seen have been in use on three pretty large schooners and I asked about the hoops and if they had any problems with them. Specifically about the spaces in the wraps and some small splits in the wood. No negative comments on them at all. They were all totally happy with them and hadn't had any prolems with them breaking or splitting further. Two of the boats had seized several of the hoops for about 1/4 of the circumfrence where it was seized to the luff. So there were some small gaps inbetween the wraps of the hoops.

In looking at hoops in maritime museums, they all have separations in the wraps and some splitting but seem to be otherwise Ok.

[mrthethird]

I went with an external SS slide.

I had read that the slide system is 10% more efficient than the hoops, but I have not sailed before, therefore I am missing much hands-on experience. I don't know how the slide would work with the gaff rig, or even if it would make a difference. Very many questions, not even sure what to ask yet, if you know what I mean.

[Barry Pyeatt]

Any sail is likely to be more efficient if there is no gap between the luff and the mast. But it is bit more difficult to work a gaff with a luff groove track since the gaff has to be laced. Not impossible, just more of an issue.

There is an issue of mast shape and air flow over the leading edge with some turbulance created by the shadow of the mast on the luff edge of the sail. But having gaps with mast rings and/or allowing the luff to be placed further away from the mast rather than closer to it decreases efficiency.

Ideally, I feel it would be better to have a constant diameter (round) mast up to the gaff position and then taper it. A birdsmouth is relatively easy to do this way and then use an alternate side lacing with more grommets. This will keep a fairly taut and even luff held fairly close to the mast.

The gaffer I used off Grenada had been set up with a luff slide set into the mast originally but it became too much of an issue for the owner so he switched to lacing. I've never used a luff slide with a gaff rig so I don't actually know if it would make any meaningful difference in performance over mast hoops or lacing.

:?: :?

[timnphx]

You are not alone. I have not sailed either. I started building a small row boat that is about 12 1/2 feet for sue as a trout fishing and such. The plans also show it with small sails, so decided to make the sails, mast, and started on the rigging. I am hoping to take a local sailing class soon before I take my own boat out sailing. But in the mean time doing a lot of researching and reading about it all. Here is a picture of my boat I call Lil' Marauder.

[Charlie Jones]

Barry- last year I built a 22 foot replacement mast for a gaffer over in Florida, and that's how we built that one- untapered up to just above the hounds, then tapered to the truck. Pretty simple to do (relatively) using the birdsmouth method.

Oops! Make that year before last now- it's a new year now

[Barry Pyeatt]

Charlie,

Any idea what (approx.) that mast ended up weighing? I have some nice Sitka Spruce that is being used for a friends replacement mast. 24' in length. I've already scarfed the 16' sticks together but am not to the point of ripping the staves as yet.

I'm also curious if you have had any experience with a luff groove on a birdsmouth. It would need to be an outside mounted track in my estimation.

I can visualize how I might make it an internal track but have not actually seen it done. And I'm being asked if we can make that mast with an internal luff track.