mustangermatt

I've had solid spruce masts on my CS 17 for about 5 years. They are plenty stiff, 3 1/2" at the base to about 40% up the mast then tapering to 2" at the top. I think they are a little heavier than aluminium, and certainly more expensive. But they look REALLY good and the boat gets comments wherever I take it.

Or, you could get a fix at the start of you tack by triangulating, then note your heading, then get a fix at the end of your tack and compare the compass course to the course made good to get your leeway. Then you don't have to fork out 500 bucks for a gps. Call me cheap :-)

I was trying to beat around Marrowstone pt to Port Townsend a few weeks ago, against 2 1/2 - 3 knot current, about 10-15 knt wind.. I couldn't make it quite around the point, but could hold position. I found staying a little off the wind and keeping boat speed up worked better than trying to point as high as the boat can go. I was getting to within 50 feet of the beach so I had a very good reference as to distance made good, or not made good in this case :-)

Cool pictures, looks like it was a great trip. We have alot of tide here in the northwest, and rocky shoreline to boot. I have found I like to carry a couple hundred feet of decent line. When I come into an anchorage I drop the hook in deep enough water that the boat will stay afloat when the rode is pointing toward shore. I put a pulley and buoy (usually a fender) on the end of the anchor rode, then create a loop of line that the boat is attached to. The loop is secured to something solid on the beach, looks like you might have to use another anchor on those long sandy beaches. Now I can beach the boat and unload the camping gear or whatever, then pull the boat out to the to the pulley on the anchor rode using the loop of line. You can leave whenever you want that way, but it can be alot of screwing around, especially at 1:00 am (don't ask how I know this ). The other option is just to plan arrival and departure around tides, kind of a novel approach that I find difficult with the light winds around here:-) I did read on the web site about the couple that took a bay river skiff to mexico, and used fenders to roll the boat on and off the beach. I haven't tried that one yet. It might be dicey with the weight of my CS17 loaded, and even more so with your 20.

Water ballast located to windward is an interesting idea I hadn't considered. Maybe a fast electric pump would help with the problem of moving the water back and forth. Or maybe an idea like Robs jerry cans set in racks on the windward side and then carried across. It still seems to me that on a planing hull like the Core Sounds the extra weight would cancel out any gain from the ballast. Maybe ??? Maybe the next time we get a good steady wind I will put the boat on Lake Washington and experiment.

Rob mentioned in his new rig thread that he was considering water ballast. I have my own ideas about it but wanted to see if I was crazy, and it seemed like a separate topic from Robs rig discussion. I have experimented with ballasting my cs 17, and found that I didn't notice any real reduction in angle of heel. I did notice the boat wouldn't plane as easily. With one or two of my teenage kids with me, we have a drastic effect on lateral trim just by moving side to side, and in this scenario the "ballast" is useful for handling lines and taking the helm Where I really notice the difference of adding any kind of weight to a Core Sound is motoring with my little 2HP Evinrude. Weight REALLY slows things down. The only time I have considered the Core Sound any thing close to tender is sailing single handed. In this case I have found it more effective to shorten sail rather than add ballast because I reduce the angle of heel and the boat is still light enough to pop up on plane, even with the reduced sail area. The final consideration I have is that when you keep the boat flat with more weight (especially people), you are able to load the rig more without capsizing. This is good to a point, but I think eventually things start to fail if this is carried too far. I know the McGregors use water ballast and it is very successful, but perhaps the ballast is a much greater percentage of the displacement than we could get with cans in the bilge. I think that ratio of ballast on a Core Sound would really detract from the overall performance. Has anyone sailed one of the Sea Pearls, I believe they use water ballast.

Sounds like a cool trip. I don't know the area, but I have to say that to my way of thinking sailing to windward against a gale in an irrigation ditch beats rowing any day

Probably not much help but I put my outboard on one of those bracket mounts that bolts to the transom and adjusts up and down. With the mount about half way up and the outboard tilted forward it is clear of the sheets. I have the aft deck configuration so hanging the outboard directly off the transom wasn't an option. If I remember right you have yours hung on the transom, and probably don't want to go to the expense and trouble of adding the bracket type mount. Maybe a traveler that would pass over the hight of the outboard?

I finally got out sailing this weekend after repainting and rerigging my cs17. One of the big changes was to add an outboard mount and evenrude 2hp outboard. I had asked for advice on suitable power before I got the 2hp, and I had expected about 3-3 1/2 knots. Boy was I suprised :-) I get about 4 knots at 3/4 throttle, and 5 knots at full, measured over a known mile on a lake. I think the shallow pitch 3 blade prop helps alot. In any case it just doesn't take much to move one of these boats around. But, as expected once I was done playing with my new toy we started sailing and the outboard sat unused on its new mount for the rest of the day :-)

Thanks for the input. I went ahead and got the 2hp. The only times I need the outboard are when there is no wind and I have to catch a tide. Around the San Juans it isn't uncommon to ride an ebb down one channel, and then catch the flood to go up another channel. With no wind I often can't row far/fast enough to catch the next tide. Then my timing is messed up for the rest of the day. I think if there is enough wind to cause problems for the little motor I will be sailing anyway.

If there is any kind of sea running it's better not to try to sail too close to the wind. The boat isn't heavy enough to plow through large chop, not only are you going slower but leeway increases too. If you fall off a little, the increased speed more than makes up for the few degrees in pointing you give up. Besides, it's always more fun to go faster no matter which direction your pointing :-)

I am finally going to put a motor on my cs17. I am wondering what the best size is. I have 3hp johnson that will probably take a couple hundred to get running. I have also seen 2hp motors in good shape for $250. I am not looking to plane or anything, just looking to move the boat at around 4-5 knots when the wind isn't blowing. Distances can be up to 20 miles (no electrics :-)

I use regular booms on my cs17. I was able to put about 10% more sail area on a mast 1' shorter than the plans, but I do have a head knocker and some visibility lost. Works fine and definitely an option if you like the more traditional approach. The sprit rig is pretty cool though :-)

Looks great. Do I see a washer/dryer in the background? I'll bet your wife loves doing laundry in the boat shop :-)

No screws on my 17, just tape and epoxy. I have pounded the boat for two years and it has held together.

I built the centerboard for my cs 17 out of foam and glass instead of wood. It came out very light and strong. What I did find was that I like working with wood better than glass, but I think the composite is an excellent material. I also have considered building a glass boat, so keep us up to date :-) I am especially interested in how the weight comes out. I have always thought glass would be lighter, but I have read the opposite on the forum.

I borrowed an idea from kayakers (I think anyway). I have a bungee cord hooked to the bottom of the compartment and to the center of the hatch (underside). Works pretty well. I can just lift up an edge to access for small items, and unhook the bungee for big ones.

Sails are a place you can economize quite a bit. www.baconsails.com has a huge selection of reasonably priced used sails. Their description of condition and size were very accurate. I changed my rig from sprit to trad booms, but I found a number of jibs that would have worked well for the sprit sails. Cost for my two sails was about $150 including shipping.

My center board is a constant cross section from top to bottom (naca 012) with the bottom surface 90 degrees to the leading edge. I do this because my board does go completely vertical to maintain the high aspect ratio for windward performance in light air. As you angle the board the chord lengthens in relation to water flow, good for fast but less lift slow. The only times I adjust the board aft is running, and when I reef by dropping the foresail (main to the rest of you :-) This allows me to steer on just the main (again mizzen to every one else). This arangement seems to work very well.

I spent my vacation last summer at lake Chelan. The lake and surrounds are gorgeous, but not the best sailing. The mountain thermals and canyons made for very unpredictable wind velocities and directions. We rarely had the same wind for more than twenty minutes, and it would regularly go from flat calm to 25 knots and back to calm again in ten to fifteen minutes. We stayed at the state park and sailed around from there. If I had it to do again I would load up the boat and make the epic voyage up to Stehikan (epic without an outboard, a long day with).

About weight aloft. I was concerned about this because I built oversize solid spruce masts for my 17. I think they came out to about 20-25 lbs apiece. Turns out the only time I notice the weight is when I step them. They are also very stiff. Probably not as forgiving to puffs as the more flexible masts, but again the boat has never capsized so I guess it works out ok.

I would recommend aganst using red cedar for a spar. The fiber length is much shorter than spruce or fir. Also the fibers seperate REALLY easily. Thats one of the reasons it makes such great kindling :-) It works really well for planking though.

My masts are one piece spruce, with a sheeve inletted at the head for the halyard. The lacing starts at the head, goes down and around the mast to the first grommet, then reverses the twist to the next and so on. This prevents sagging and snagging, the sails slide up almost effortlessly and will quickly drop from their own weight. I built a rowing seat on the centerboard that is actually an extension of the thwart. My oarlocks are just aft of the mizzen so when I reach all the way forward for a stroke I am reaching around the mizzen. Works ok but I will probably move the locks a little further forward at some time. 8' oars work for me too. I overcame the rail height issue by sitting on a three inch cushion. 9' oars would be the best though.

Ok, here I go bucking the tide again. I did my centerboard foam and glass and so i have a few thoughts on this subject. I got some advice not to do it composite but it worked out really well. I was able to easily achieve a true and accurate NACA foil. Lighter is definitely better in performance boats. Build it 1/3 lighter then put that weight back in low as ballast if you want, Or if you're wild and crazy add a trapeze, build stronger masts, add sail area and fasten your seatbelt :-) Also depending on thickness of foam (like 3/4"), you're likely going to get a much stronger hull than 1/4" ply could be based on the additional leverage against tension and compression. There is a reason airplanes are built this way and not with ply (well, I guess a few have been, spruce goose anyone) :-). The downside is that wood is alot more fun to work with. I hate epoxying things. Also we are not really talking about a coresound here since the whole concept is probably out of scope of the average home builder. Ok, I have had my little say, let the rebuttles fly :-)

I keep weight in the forward compartment which keeps the bow from slaping and pounding so much. It seems that alot of the spray I get comes from the forward part of the chine, not the bow. But this affects the ability to plane and when water does come over it is solid, not spray :-) The best solution I have found is to keep rain gear aboard just like life jackets. On long trips up here hypothermia is a real danger if people get wet and are exposed to wind. This is also common practice on the bigger baots around here, especially racing when you can't srop sailing and send the crew below to warm up :-)