capt jake Posted March 17, 2003 Posted March 17, 2003 OK, here is the tiller set-up. It is laminated Honduran made from a template taken from a Catalina 22. I need to know if (in this photo) it is placed about right in the cockpit or??? Thanks!! Quote
Derek Posted March 17, 2003 Posted March 17, 2003 Can't really help you with tiller location, but she sure is looking good! Quote
Knut Posted March 17, 2003 Posted March 17, 2003 Jake, it sure looks good and I don't think there are so many different ways of doing this. However, there are some things that the picture is not showing and that you may want to consider. Do you have a hinge for the tiller arm so you can swing it vertically? Not that you will frequently want to be standing up, but there are bound to be moments when you would like not to bend down to hold the tiller. The only other suggestion I have is the length of the tiller arm. The longer it gets the more of a sector it will sweep in the small cockpit. This is another reason why the arm should be hinged so that you can lift it over people's knees etc. when tacking and in other situations when a quick rudder move is necessary. Personally I would keep the tiller as short as possible and use a lightweight, foldable and swiveling extension arm. This is perfect when you want to sit on the side-deck and still reach the tiller with full control, still from a comfortable position. I have used a tiller on small keel-boats before and for the sailing of a Weekender it is clearly the best solution (in my opinion). To save space, the wheel has advantages, but even with the very smooth modified system I have on my boat, it cannot compete with a tiller regarding response, feeling and possibility to move around and still controlling the rudder (with an extension). Good luck! Quote
capt jake Posted March 17, 2003 Author Posted March 17, 2003 Personally I would keep the tiller as short as possible That be me question there matey!! Does this look too long?? I can not see me venturing out with more than one other person. Thank you Quote
Barry Pyeatt Posted March 17, 2003 Posted March 17, 2003 Jake my friend, I don't think you are going to know about the length and whether or not it is right for you until you use it a bit under varying conditions. The Catalina 22 tiller is a good length for the Weekender and a number of other builders have used it and find it totally acceptable. I agree that you are going to want it to pivot so you can swing it up and use it no matter if you are standing, sitting on the seat or on the rail. So, I wouldn't trim it at this stage. Most often people are looking for extensions to allow them to work with it from further away rather than cutting it shorter. Your boat is looking mighty fine! When will the glass case be done to display it? Are you sure you are going to want to get it wet? Quote
Frank Hagan Posted March 17, 2003 Posted March 17, 2003 Waaaaaay too long! You won't have any "feedback" from the tiller with it that long, and you'll weave all over the sea lanes! :shock: Mine protrudes into the cockpit about 13" when on the centerline, and when its hard over to starboard over the splash coaming is just about 6" forward of the edge of the lazarette. Mine protruded about 20" initially, and was too long. It was hard to come about, as I had to lift it up (hinge is a good idea!), duck under it, and then move over to the other side. And it was a mushy helm ... no feedback, hard to sail in a straight line, no feedback from the tiller (kind of like that awful mushy power steering found on cars when they first introduced it). Not wanting to cut my expensive tiller too short, I used a temporary tiller that protruded about 8" into the cockpit, and met the corner of the splash coaming and the lazarette when it was hard over to port or starboard. I really liked that size, and cut the Catalina down to that size. THEN I sailed it in a stiff breeze :roll: and realized I was really having to hold on to it. So I built my third tiller long enough to protrude into the cockpit 13", and that's been a great compromise. I still get plenty of feedback from the helm, but don't have to really hang on to it when the wind pipes up. Quote
capt jake Posted March 17, 2003 Author Posted March 17, 2003 Most often people are looking for extensions to allow them to work with it from further away rather than cutting it shorter. One view and then; Waaaaaay too long!......So I built my third tiller long enough to protrude into the cockpit 13", ... No wonder I am always confused. Both seem to have valid points. Maybe a quickly detatchable/ re-locatable/tiltable tiller is in order!! Quote
Frank Hagan Posted March 18, 2003 Posted March 18, 2003 Well, whenever I'm looking for advice, I always take actual experience as a better guide than general knowledge! :wink: Make it long, then start whittling it down. Or make a temporary short one to see how it feels before cutting that nice shiny tiller down! Quote
MikeStevenson Posted March 18, 2003 Posted March 18, 2003 I just posted a tiller note on the other board, but will mention one thing here: Make sure your rudder box is up to the task of transferring the torque all th eway to the rudder. An over-the-deck tiller means a tall rudder box, consequently more flex, etc. The one in the plans is designed to be short. You'll note our Kauai Weekender had the tiller in the same place the stub tiller is in the wheel steering. Mike Quote
capt jake Posted March 18, 2003 Author Posted March 18, 2003 Thanks Mike, I can't find the other post. Maybe I should post a picture of the rudder box for some input there also?? Quote
Knut Posted March 18, 2003 Posted March 18, 2003 Jake, just a small clarification: You are quoting seemingly contradictory advise in one of your postings (the need for extensions and the need to keep it short). There is not necessarily any conflict here, because what you should aim for is a quite short, hinged permanent tiller arm as indicated by Frank. In addition to this short main tiller arm you mount on top, hinged to the forward end of it, an extension handle (often aluminum) that is clipped to the tiller and pointing to the rear when NOT in use. When you need it, unclip it, turn it around on the forward rotational hinge point (and may be you even find one with an adjustable longitudinal extension), and you can operate the tiller from quite some distance. This extension will not be permanently in the way of everything when not needed. Quite practical in my experience! Quote
MikeStevenson Posted March 18, 2003 Posted March 18, 2003 Note Here: http://www.byyb.org/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=2109&forum=2&8 Mostly I mentioned stuff about the Weekender we did in Kauai. Mike Quote
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