Why no 12N?

[Arlen]

I've long admired the Spindrift, especially the nesting versions due to ease of stowage. I've really enjoyed checking out all of your pictures here.

I'm just curious ... why no 12N? I figured this had been asked, but haven't found it.

Two larger adults could pretty much exceed the maximum capacity (sailing) given on the B&B site for the 11, and larger frames would do well to have the additional length I'd think. Would there be anything preventing someone from applying the nesting details to the Spindrift 12?

[Garry]

I asked Graham about that when I was considering mine. If I recall its only because no one has ordered one yet. I'm completely happy with the 11N but I was concerned more with general seaworthiness in rough conditions than challenging the weight capacity.I believe it would easily handle four persons in general habor conditions but I wouldn't want that many if its rough.

[Arlen]

Thanks Garry, very helpful!

If I recall correctly from reading other posts of yours, you are a cruiser who built an 11N as a tender? (ok, ok ... so I spent a couple hours over the weekend drooling over your expedition dinghy and your other sailboats, lol). I'm quite landlocked, just about smack-dab in the middle of the US, and my cruising is mostly imaginary ... my needs are a bit more modest, but it's the versatility of the Spindrift that attracts me.

If I build a spindrift one day (after my current project) it would largely be for fishing small lakes under power, puttering around on smaller lakes under sail, and rowing across even smaller lakes to get to a couple favorite secluded campsites. Also, I like the idea that the Spindrift would fit nicely on my popup camper, or even atop my blazer, and that the nesting version could break down for storage in a modest garden shed (no garage available, only room for one boat in the drive).

But I'm a big guy, come from big stock, and have a few big friends. How would you feel about a couple 6'-5" 300+ pounders along for the ride in your 11' dinghy? Then add in my 6'-1, just under 300 self. Is it getting scary yet?

<edit> I imagine under power or rowing 2 and occassionally 3 on board (if rowing + camping gear), under sail: 2 max</edit>

Appreciate any comments

[Arlen]

I kind of wondered if 12' would be adequate. Suppose it's probably not that hard to find a rental for the day at a couple of the larger lakes w/in an afternoon's drive. If I remember right, 12' aluminum boats have a pretty low freeboard which would be a bit scary with a couple big guys moving about. 14's may too, can't remember. My dad had a 16 for years, and it was fine for what he needed but would be hell to cartop. It may be that my only solution will be to trailer, but that means it won't go if the camper does, which is where I'm going to be when the weekender is complete (and it won't make much of a fishin' boat either).

As I think the Spindrift is largely considered a tender, not sure if anyone's even requested exploring a modification to 14'. I'll have to e-mail Graham if and when I actually start looking to start into a project like this. Guess I could always stick to canoeing.

[Garry]

For maximum stability and load capacity in a small boat, I doubt you can beat the hard chine design of the Spindrifts. The Spindrift nesting dinghys are intended as a tender to be loaded and handled on the deck of the boat which tends to limit their size and weight. With a little help, you should be able to handle a larger size dinghy for cartopping depending on the car of course. I cartopped the 11N on my Dodge Caravan from California to Florida and locally until we found a house. I had help loading it but I have seen a nice little arrangement to help one person load a dinghy on a car from the side.

I enjoy the stability of the Spindrift. I find that climbing into the dinghy from the boat is easy because I can step just about anywhere with little concern (I'm 180 lbs.). Its even more stable once one person is in the dinghy. For your use, I would guess that you would limit a 12 footer to two 300 lb. people; a 14 foot version might handle three.

I have also seen a rig to haul a boat on a ramp built into the bed of a pickup at an angle with the bow up over the cab. Then you could haul the camper also. But I wasn't able to find a link for it.

[Arlen]

Thanks for the input Garry, most helpful.

I'd run things by Graham first, but out of curiosity as you've gone thru the building process, would simply scaling the plans for the 12 up to 14 or stretching the 12 to 14 be most doable? Or would it require some additional redesign to be practical from a builder's & users perspective considering my goals (i.e. I suspect I might need to have an additional scarf for the panels)?

<edit> I've seen a rig for single-handed car topping too, something like a hinged cradle that allows you to load comfortably from the side and then move it into place for the drive. Probably have a bookmark somewhere. </edit>

[Charlie Jones]

Arlen- tack and tape boats aren't that easy to "scale up" The physical shape of the panels is what gives the boat it's shape- if you just made them longer, the beam, etc would shift- unless you were to build a scale model first, there's no telling just how it would come out, shape wise.

Now building a more traditional design, with offsets to stations, you can simply spread the stations a bit and do that- usually within 10% one way or the other.

Personally, being a builder and NOT a designer, I leave that stuff to folks like Graham. If I can't find THE design from one designer, then I look til I do, rather than risk changes I can't predict..

[Arlen]

Good advice Charlie, thanks for that. I'll keep looking, I'm not ready to do this yet anyway. Wonder about the wisdom of building a more traditionally built boat, then applying nesting principals to it? (i.e. bulkheads, then cut in half). Seems like that might hold just as many dangers, eh?

[Steve Day]

Arlen,

I have a Spindrift 10N and find it to be a delightful dinghy for my 40' boat. I, however, wanted something a little faster with a planing hull for exploring the Five Rivers Delta here in upper Mobile Bay.

I found a 11' "Fast Garvey" (GV-11) at the Perdido Wood Boat Show last year and liked it enough to build it. It has a 5' beam and quite a bit of freeboard. It is very stable and I can walk anywhere on the bottom of the boat without fear of tipping it over (I am 220 pounds). Here is a shot of the boat taken last week, when I was out exploring the delta. I was just coming up on the plane when this was taken.

By no means do I want to take anything away from Graham's boats. I love them and will build more when I can. The Garvey just fills a need that I have and might be something you could use to skulk around Branched Oak and some of the other lakes near you. I used to do that in my Spindrift a couple of years ago when I lived in York.

Steve

[Charlie Jones]

Steve- that's a good looking little skiff- got more pics?

[Arlen]

Hi Steve ... York eh? You really were up in my neck of the woods. Yeah, Branched Oak, Pawnee lake are definite draws. I also camp a lot south in Kansas which is where I tend to pull the camper, and will be looking to cartop.

I'll definitely look closely at the Garvey skiff, you've got a great looking boat there and the stability sounds great. Thanks for the suggestion!

[Steve Day]

Charlie,

Yes, I have a few. I'll try to send you some direct when I get on the other computer with all the pics on it.

It was a fun build and the boat is great to run around on the delta at 15 to 20 knots.

Steve

[Greg Luckett]

Steve- that's a good looking little skiff- got more pics?

You might find more of the information and pics via http://www.bateau.com/proddetail.php?prod=GV11&cat=9

My first stich and glue was the PK78, which I still have but will probably dispose of this year. Its information can be seen at: http://www.bateau.com/proddetail.php?prod=PK78 . Mine never looked that nice but it was an easy design to start with.

I much prefer B&B designs now a days.

Greg.

[Charlie Jones]

Says the PK 78 is no longer available- sorry.

[Greg Luckett]

Says the PK 78 is no longer available- sorry.

Must be a glitch in Bateau's site because it is available, that link just won't show it. If you go to the root directory, then to the small boats, then to the dinghies, it comes up fine and uses the link from earlier....go figure?

Sorry for the confusion, Charlie.

It is an interesting design due to the V bottom rather than a flat one.

PK78.pdf

[Jim McLaren]

It's the period. Always put a space, not a period after a hyperlink. Been there, done that

Greg, if you edit your post to put a space between the link and the period, it will work.

[Greg Luckett]

It's the period. Always put a space' date=' not a period after a hyperlink. Been there, done that

Greg, if you edit your post to put a space between the link and the period, it will work.[/quote']

Aha!!! :oops: Thanks!!!