Vinyl Coated Cable, a cautionary tale

[Dave R1]

What a deal, Jake! You should spend more time looking around there. I bet they won't let passengers carry on other tools like tablesaws and lathes. You could probably get a deal on them, too.

[capt jake]

You'de be surprised what people try to take on! They have surplus tools also, but they have been putting them on E-Bay lately.

[Frank Hagan]

There's another way to make an eye in the new line, and I think its as strong (or stronger) than a splice. I've done both, and this one is much easier, but slightly less "salty" looking if you really look close.

Get a sail repair needle and some sail repair thread. After threading the needle, form your loop in the line and stab the needle through the middle of both the standing and bitter part of the line that forms your loop. Wrap once around both parts, then a quarter more and stab again at 90 degrees to the first stab. Then, using the needle and thread, wrap the joint neatly from just above your "stab" to the bottom of the bitter end, thread the needle back up and under the wraps and out between two of the top wraps, and cut the thread.

This forms a tight eye that won't come apart, and looks pretty finished to boot. I've done both this and splicing, and this is much faster and, probably because of my splicing skills, even looks a bit better than the lump I get when splicing braided line.

[umop_apisdn]

I have used a "cinching wrap" to make an eye before. I wrap the whipping cord in a figure eight around the standing and bitter ends of the line, and pull it as tight on each wrap as I can. I do this for an inch or so and tie off the whipping cord.

It makes a very neat looking eye. But I have only used it for low-load applications, such as fenders and the like. I wonder how long you would have to make such a wrap to equal the breaking strength of the rope. A few stiches with some spectra fishing line would make it a lot stronger as well, I imagine.

I think I will wrap up an eye or two this weekend and give them a tug with my truck, and see how they hold up.

Noel

[Craig]

I use wax cord for making eyes as Frank suggests and for the past six years one has held up my main. All of my eyes are done this way with Sta-Set line from Boat US. From a maintenance standpoint I would look for some small diameter SS cable for the stays and fix them with copper swedges.. 1/8 inch SS would hold a double stay just fine.

[umop_apisdn]

This weekend I tied up several eyes in some 1/4 nylon rope using a variety of wrapping and lashing methods, and the pulled on them with my Jeep. The other end of the line was secured to the towhook on my car with a Butterfly Knot.

To summarize, they didn't work too well. Even wrapping the rope for 6 inches with a tight figure 8 wrap would still pull out before the knot would break.. The only eye that held was where I sewed the eye closed with 80lb Spectra fishing line for the distance of about 4 inches. Which was as much work as a splice and way uglier.

Guess I will just splice the eyes, and if they look bad, I'll wrap them to cover up the splice.

Noel.

[Dave R1]

Noel, my offer is still there if you'd like me to splice the eyes for you. No charge but postage.

[Craig]

Now comes the old test engineer with the questions. What does the working load of the eyes need to be? Add 20% for safety and what is the number? Now how much force did you apply with that vehicle? How did you mesaure this force and was the strain gage calibrated? To what tollerance? Was this rope good yacht grade rope or the lumberyard stuff?I suspect you overstressed the eye by several orders of magnitude pulling by it with a car. I "doubt" (never measured) the maximum pressure on my Vacs main halyard is 500 lb. Then again the more splices you do the better you will get at doing them. When you get it just right you can do mine too.

[umop_apisdn]

Ok, the rope was 1/4 nylon, from a hardwared store, several years old, but no obvious signs of wear.

in one end I tied a butterfly knot to make a loop, and hooked it over the trailer hitch on my Samurai, the other end I would tie up a loop using some kind of wrapping method. That end went over the trailer ball on the Jeep. Then I gently pull until something gave.

The idea being to compare which was stronger, the knot or the tied eye.

yeah, there were lots of uncontrolled variables, but the results were still pretty one sided. Unless there was some mechanical connection between the standing and bitter ends of the eye, it wouldn't hold as well as a knot. There had to be some kind of splicing or stitching for the eye to hold.

And thanks, Dave, for the offer to splice the line for me, but I'll do it.

Although the line I am using is going to be significatly stronger than 1/8" cable anyway, so it probably wouldn't matter if I use a knot or a splice.

But the splice is the better way to go, and it will be a handy thing to know how to do, anyway.

Noel.

[Frank Hagan]

Yeah, I think unless you have a line with a lot of friction ... which most of the synthetics DON'T have ... you need to mechanically fasten them together. Which is why I use sail twine and pierce through the bottom of the loop twice, at 90 degree angles to each other.

I'll have to try the trailer hitch test! Actually, it would be interesting to test a regular splice, a mechanical "sew together" splice, and a bowline knot to see which is stronger.

Brion Toss a few years back found out that any knot in a line decreases its strength by about 50%. I don't know if a splice does the same thing. The good thing is we have synthetic line now that is so much stronger than we need that we can lose 50% of the strength and still do well.

[Dave R1]

According to Brion and some other sources I've read, a properly executed eye splice approaches 100% of the strength of the line. Some knots can approach 80% of the strength of the line. It's all a matter of friction. A seized eye will at best be as strong as the seizing thread.