Princess 22 vs Princess 26

[COLORADO BUILDER]

Hello All, This is my first time visiting here. I have been shopping around for my next boat to build. So far I have built only one, a Shellback dinghy.

I like the Princess 22 because I live in Colorado and must trailer it 1500 miles to get to an ocean, but the 26 footer would be roomier and perhaps more seaworthy. I am also on a fairly tight budjet.

Can anyone out there give me some cost estimates as to how much a 22 footer will cost to build? And how much more the 26 footer might be? I will also need to build a trailer and wonder if the 26 footer will require double axels and brakes?

Looking foward to meeting you all, Michael

[capt jake]

Hi Micheal, saw your post on the other board. Welcome aboard!!

Graham will probably see this and answer your questions in short order.

[Designer]

Hi Michael,

First of all welcome aboard! sounds like you are definately in an area which requires a portable boat! It is tough to give estimates of building costs...some folks can manufacture, or scrounge most of the boat beyond the hull - others get everything new/professionally made to order etc... so I would say that you can spend between $5,000.00 and $8,000.00 on a Princess 22. The 26 is about 40% - 60% more. The 26 is definately a bigger load to trailer - so you might also have to consider the extra coast of a dual axle trailer and the need for a car powerful enough to pull the load - and where you are you definately have some up/down terrain!

We are strongly of the philosphy that if you want/need to economize you do so on the bolt-on changeable parts of the boat, but reserve the bulk of your funds for using a good marine plywood/epoxy for the hull. You can upgrade hardware, sails, etc...over the years, but the value of your boat will always be dependent on the quality of the hull. Also we realize that you are not likely to have many marine flea markets and used parts places near you! But you might be able to find some stuff on line used, or take a trip to a boating center where there is such a place and have at it.

For a better idea of costs where you live, we can send you the material list(s) and you can actually price things out at your own locale. Just drop us an e-mail and ask.

One example of a way to economize without sacrificing quality/building integrity is in epoxy - you get it from Raka or us for about 40.00/35.00 respectively, or you can buy WEST at nearly twice the cost. On the other hand, you will have to ship in Marine plywood....there is no other substitute - however, we give a source list for suppliers around the country, so you will know where to get it. Another place you can have big differences - you can go and buy ingots of lead or scrap lead or collect wheel weights and fishing weights while you are building and save a good deal. Make your upholstery - have it made - again a big difference. New engine, used engine - no engine....As you can see there are so many decisions that can make a big big difference in building costs. Which is why we give such a big spread on cost.

[COLORADO BUILDER]

Thank you Graham,

Living here does present a few more obstacles to building a boat. The price range you outlined is about what I was expecting for the Princess 22 and about as much as I will be able to afford if I expect to build in the next 18 to 24 months. And my Toyota Tacoma probably would not be adequate for towing the larger boat.

I have no sailing experience beyond sailing my Shellback dinghy in the local lakes. But I have definitely been bitten by the bug and have a dream of sailing down in the Caribbean or the Sea of Cortez. I also fell in love with the boatbuilding process. I started making my living as a carpenter and then switched to Architecture (easier on the body) but have always enjoyed woodworking and now have a small hobby shop and enjoy making furniture etc. Then last winter I purchased a copy of Woodenboat magazine and on a lark built a model of the Shellback. Then I was hooked. I couldn’t afford the kit for the full size Shellback so I built it from scratch.

This summer I visited Mexico for the first time (Cabo in August and Cozumel in December) and now I want to sail there on extended camping vacations. So I need a bigger boat. Having looked at many designs through the Woodenboat forum I have settled on the Princess for a few reasons. It seems fairly easy and economical to build and easy to sail for a novice. And from what I see on your forum you provide ongoing help and advice to all of your builders. While I am a good woodworker I am ignorant of most things nautical and will undoubtedly need that advice not only for building but also for materials and sailing information. And of course having a forum dedicated to your designs will give me access to many other builders and their advice as well.

I plan to install a concrete slab this spring on which I will construct a temporary carport (tented enclosure) since my garage shop is not long enough. So I will probably be ordering plans from you very soon. As I won’t be able to start building until June I may build a model this winter.

My only remaining question to you now that you know my background and where I plan to sail, is the Princess 22 a good choice for me?

Thank you for your welcome and happy holidays, Michael Slingsby

[Guest]

You finished you first project in short order, Michael. I can't comment on this project. But if your previous experience in the short time frame is any indication of your ability, then either boat will probably be a breeze for you.

[Designer]

I am pleased that you like our Princess 22.

Yes, this has become a great forum with lots of folks willing to share their experience and knowledge with our fellow builders. Frank deserves all the credit for it's existence- and maintaining it.

The P22 was was designed to do exactly what you intend to do with it. I was at Cabo a couple of years ago and would love to get a P22 down there one day. She was not intended to cross oceans, but with normal seamanship and common sense you can do a lot of good cruising.

I have a good friend who lost his beautifully restored Rhodes 44 wooden boat in the Sea of Cortez this past summer and yet she was a superb sea boat. He made a bad decision and had really bad luck, he was anchored behind an island when a bad squall put him on a lee shore and she was on the rocks before he could do anything about it. He lost everything he owned.

I think that you will be pleasantly surprised at how comfortable she is for the type of cruising you intend to do. Also, since she is easy to launch, set up and retrieve, you can easily do one area one day and go to a completely different sailing locale the next. Ocean/River/Lake... you can do it all in one vacation!

[Charlie Jones]

Let me kick in here, that I'm always happy to help with building problems too.

I think I built the second Princess 22 that was done. It's not a bad project and Graham and Carla have become a friends I think, from our phones talks. I sent him a CD with literally THOUSANDS ( ) of pictures on it of the building process.

Great folks and the owner of the one I built claims it's a wonderful sailer.

[Terry Dunn]

Hello Colorado Builder,

You should have a lot of fun building a P22. I built a Core Sound 20 and have sailed it the past two summers.

Buying materials to build boats in Colorado can be a pain. For my Core Sound 20 I purchased okoume plywood from Edensaw in Kent Wa. and picked it up at the freight yard in Commerce City. I ordered the plywood over the phone on Monday and had it before the following weekend. Great service. Great product. Good prices. I used doug fir from Home Depot for the rest of the construction materials. After I finished the hull on my CS 20, I ran into a guy that had purchased the old bleacher seats from Denver West High. Mahogany, 14

[COLORADO BUILDER]

Hey Terry,

Glad to know I’m not the only wooden boatbuilder in Colorado. I’m sure there are a number of canoe and kayak builders but I haven’t met anyone who builds sailboats. Thanks for the lead on plywood, someone else had suggested having it shipped to a depot and picking it up myself to save money – the freight yard sounds even better. The info about trailers is also good to hear, perhaps I won’t need to build one after all. I guess I automatically assume nothing will be available around here. I do have a source for mahogany and other hardwoods.

I don’t know if the cs20 has a cast lead keel or aluminum masts? A local source on those items would be appreciated. I have not yet ordered plans or a material list, but hope to be able to purchase plans and start ordering materials mid-January – I don’t have my boatshed yet but I’m sure there are plenty of things I can work on in the woodshop before spring. I’m starting to get excited, it seems to be coming together.

Charlie,

I have seen some of your “how to” pictorial postings. They are great! They are part of the reason I decided on Graham’s designs. I had no idea how to go about casting a lead keel – your pictorial made me feel much more confidant.

Michael