Self rescue

[Mark Gudschinsky]

Are there permanently mounted co2 powered flotation bags out there that are an appropriate size for our boats that might make it possible to float a a swamped Weekender high enough to make bailing possible? You know, like the life jackets.

[Mike Pennington]

There was a company out of UK selling such systems for cruising boats. I don't know fow well they did. I read the article in Sail Magazine I believe a couple of years back.

[Stump]

How low does the Weekender sit when swamped? Would it be possible to raise or lenthen the coamings to that the boat cockpit would sit high enough to bail? If you added the foam behind the seats like some people are doing would that raise the rear of the boatsbe high enough to bail? What if you pushed the bow down some? The lowest point of the freeboard seems to be right around the seats, I would think there would have to be simple fix if the boat doesn't sit high enough by it self. :?

Isn't there a picture somewhere around here with a Weekender on its side with most of the boat above the water?

What is reality? :roll:

[Mike Pennington]

Mark I found this site

http://holtallen.com/holt/bbag.html

I'm still looking, I used to have 4'x4"x4" floats for my Colman Scanoe they bolted to each side of the canoe. The boat was real hard to roll over. I'm still looking for a similar product.

http://www.seamarknunn.com/catalog/subcat151.htm

http://www.marinestore.co.uk/thestore/buoybags.html

[Knut]

Stump,

my WE had raised full length coamings, but this was not enough to allow bailing after righting. Also, if you have the standard wheel steering, the hole in the transom will be under water and you will not be able to bail faster than the inflow through this opening. A standard WE is as close to impossible to bail in the water as you can get.

In my opinion, this is by far the single most important negative aspect of the WE design since it has to do with safety. (Basically, there are no other negative aspects at all!!).

What to do? Build in floatation and full length coamings (and mount a watertight jacket on the tiller transom opening if you have one) to ensure that the righted boat floats high enough that you can bail it in the water. Watertight compartments in the bow (with a tight fitting hatch!) and behind the seats + the lazarette (with tight hatches), is probably the simplest and best solution as described by Ray.

Without the ability to bail the boat in the water, the only safe way of using it would be by severely limiting distance to land or by making sure that external help would be available if needed (especially at low water temperature). Even with tested and verified bailing capability, you have to consider where you go, who is in the boat (kids, not so fit persons etc) and you have to practice the recovery under real conditions. As a note in this respect: Even with very good added floatation, there will be a limit on wave height above which bailing will not be possible.

Don't take this as an attempt at scaring anyone or reducing the fun of operating a WE or Vacationer. However, there is no substitute for being realistic and prepared once you are on the water.

Have fun

[Stump]

Thanks gang! Wonderful information as always. Now to decide how to make it workable for me

[Mark Gudschinsky]

Well apparently self inflating buoyancy bags don't exist as a standard commercial application.

It appears that if we want some we're going to have to build them ourselves.

I believe what I'll try is buying a commercial manually inflated bag and adapt some form of co2 canister or cartridge to fill it. I'll figure on a device to prevent over inflation, and try different capacities of cylinders or cartridges for volume.

Hmm, attaching hoses and deciding on fill valves etc. will take other experimenting. This should end up costing way more than I figure!

I only have a few winter chores lined up for The Flyer, And Swimmer, is supposed to be Alexanders job. So before Laura takes over the boat shed to start on her new boat I might be able to squeeze in this idea. :?

[Mike Pennington]

Mark,

I still haven't found the flotation planks I'm looking for, I believe I'll be learning to make them, too. A scientist's work is never done

Closed cell spray foam, floats, now I just need a coating / shell to keep it from being shredded. Maybe foam a board up in layers, shape it, then fiberglass it. It would have to be stream lined to look good, but the rail wouldn't go under. Besides, when my girl breaks loose and goes dock bashing on her own, like last summer, she'll have a little armor. :wink:

Personally, all joking aside, I think the best solution to extream healing over in a blow is to add weight to the keel like Ray did. Then counter with positive ballast up high in the boat.

[Charlie Jones]

Switlick emergency floatation bags for sale on EBay now. Being sold by an experienced sailor who posts on TSBB.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2491946285&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMESE%3AIT

Or if that doesn't work, here's the link to the TSBB post

http://bbs.trailersailor.com/forums/trailersailor/index.cgi/read/364045

[Mark Gudschinsky]

Thanks, Charlie! Good lead.

[Jacob]

Isn't there a picture somewhere around here with a Weekender on its side with most of the boat above the water?

Is this the photo you were talking about?

[kydocfrog]

Hey, wait a minute. Back a week or so ago in the what are WE shortcoming thread I made a comment about the lack of full transverse bulkhead on lazarret (sp?) and other watertight compartmentalization. I seem to remember folks really chiming in on about how you don't do water tight compartments in wooden boats. That kind of made sense...I guess...now we are back to lots of watertight seat backs, etc. etc. Odd

I think that I am going to put some sort of removable (inflated maybe) flotation in the footwells from the cabin.

DocA

[Mike Pennington]

I dont think there is anything wrong with a water tight compartment. But maybe use one of those round screw in ports to allow them to air out when on the trailer.

Mark also found his co2 charged flotaion bags.

[Stump]

nope, all though that is a pretty narly picture. 8) It turns out that the picture I was thinking of was one of the "Alaska Fleet's" in shallow water.

Looks like it was a good thing that dock was there :shock:

[Mark Gudschinsky]

The photo you're thinking of is in my gallery.

(I don't know how to link it here)

The Flyer was blown over is a sudden wind while we were up at the cabin. She wasn't floating on her side - the water was only shin deep.

(I actually used that photo and reworked it for my avatar to appear to be an overhead sketch.)

[Jacob]

The photo you're thinking of is in my gallery.

I found it.