Ravenswood Next Steps Guidance

[chazwell]

I've got the cross frames cut and sanded and the stringers cut, scarfed, and ready to go.  Now as a first time builder I'm agonizing over next steps so I'd like to gather some opinions on how others have proceeded.

 

- I've seen some discussion here about oiling the frames and stringers before assembly vs after hoping to get the joining surfaces more completely oiled.  It seems that it probably doesn't make too much difference and at least one post says the oil will seep adequately into the joints after assembly.  What are folks' experiences with this issue?

 

- At the risk of reigniting the philosophical discussion of whether to use boiled linseed or tung oils (or some other coating) and what the various available products really are made of is there any feeling as to what is in more common use for these boats now?  BLO has the availability and price advantage while in my location it wouldn't be too much of a stretch to find some real tung oil.  Then there are the questions of whether or not to thin whichever is used and how many coats and drying times and...... .  Any observations are welcome.

 

- Even further down the road I'm sort of leaning towards the 11 oz fabric for durability reasons but wonder about any difficulty working with it to get a smooth finished product.  I welcome comments about what others are using and why.

 

Of course after getting people's views on all this I may be more confused but that's when you say "just go with it" 

 

Thanks.

 

[Kudzu]

I was waiting on some of the other to chime in but I am tired of waiting.

 

- I've seen some discussion here about oiling the frames and stringers before assembly vs after hoping to get the joining surfaces more completely oiled.

 

As long as your using good wood, it will not matter. You could even leave the frame bare as long as you store in in a dry place.  But I usually oil after the frame is done.  Either will work.

 

- At the risk of reigniting the philosophical discussion of whether to use boiled linseed or tung oils (or some other coating) and what the various available products really.

 

This is a civil group so you will not get any flame wars started here. Tung oil is probably better but they are both going to dry out and need recoating..... which is not practical!  Recently I have coated one with polyurethane.  Just did my new one with Watco oil.  We will see how they hold up. My feeling is it is builder choice, just use good rot resistant wood and keep it dry when  your not paddling it.
 

 

- Even further down the road I'm sort of leaning towards the 11 oz fabric for durability reasons but wonder about any difficulty working with it to get a smooth finished product.  I welcome comments about what others are using and why.

 

11 oz has to be sewn on tightly. It doesn't have much shrinkage in it.  8 oz can be sewn on looser and then shrunk but you get better results if it tight to start with. Which isn't exactly easy.  But the newer corded stitch makes it possible.

 

Maybe some of the others will chime in with their experiences.

[Action Tiger]

My favorite kayak is 15 years old, been re-skinned twice (hey, cotton duck ain't as tough as we'd like...). She's still alive, though un-skinned now, and no signs of rot. She's made of pine with (gasp!) red oak frames, and the frame was painted from the get go.

I've made a few canoes with polyurethane on the frames, but open boats are way easy to touch up.

I was gifted 5 gallons of BLO by an old timer I know a while ago, and I've used it on all kinds of stuff, including kayak frames.

I poly-ed my FreeB frame, because it was on hand. Seems fine, so far...

As far as skinning goes, if I can pull #10 cotton duck ( NOT 10oz. canvas) tight with no cords, I'm sure the two cord stitch will allow you to get a snug 11oz skin. It is quite remarkable how effectively the two cords allow you to pull tension.

[oldpropfan]

Oiled frame after lashing with Corey's Tung Oil from Spirit Line Skin Boat Store. Quart container was enough to get 3 coats on frame and coaming with a little left over. Will probably pre-oil the frame notches on my next build but that's it, the rest gets oiled after the frame is complete.

 

Used 8 oz poly for the skin and was able to get it fairly tight while sewing.  You have to take your time and pull your stitch's through carefully to avoid getting pull holes in the fabric but it can be done. Ironed the fabric after sewing and it pulled up drum tight. Would maybe use the 11 oz on my next boat except that I like the look of the whip stitch to finish the seam line and the 11 oz fabric might be too heavy for it to turn out right.

 

The framing stage was nerve wracking for me as I got too OCD and kept checking everything 6 times. Ended up cutting out and redoing a third of the lashings because I was convinced the bow was starting to pull to the side, my son thinks I was just losing it and had been out in the sun too long   I actually found the sewing of the skin relaxing, you just get into a groove and go.

 

Take your time and have fun. I was amazed at how well my son's kayak (Shad) turned out and how nicely it paddled. I enjoyed it enough that over the winter I've been getting the parts ready for my own build which should be starting in the next week or two.

 

Al

[Rich D]

I have built many boats with many types of construction over the years but recently was my first time at sewing a skin on.  I used Jeff's 11 oz fabric and the double corded stitch and ended up with a very good finished product (much better than the glued on vinyl coated fabric it replaced). I had a few ripples along one side of the deck stringer (just on one side) before shrinking but I was able to get enough shrink to tighten everything up. I have another boat to re-skin and I may use the 8 oz fabric just to see the difference. 

   One thing I did that may have led to my rippling along the deck was that I laid my fabric at a slight bias orientation before stitching (only slight because the fabric is not wide enough to allow much). I did this because it is a common practice when making fiberglass layups to help the cloth follow the curves better. I think for SOF the fabric would work better laid straight. 

 

   As for treating the frame - I treated mine with Tung Oil after lashing. When I removed the Vinyl skin after 2 seasons there was no wood deterioration that I could see. I had some Thompson's Water Seal so I recoated the frame with that before sewing on the new skin. Much cheaper than Tung Oil - We'll see how it works. 

[Kudzu]

Just finished my new boat and used the 8 oz with the double corded stitch and I can honestly say that is a little easier with the 11 oz.  Because of the loose weave on the 8 oz your stitches must be right of you get the dreaded pull holes. By the time I got to the last half of the boat I was much better at it but I still have a few pull holes. But the 11 oz is harder on your hands because of the stiffness. It is little heavier and will add some weight. There is good in bad in both but a first timer is probably going to look better using the 11 oz.  But I had a student last year in my class that did an amazing job sewing his! Mine doesn't look as good as his did by any means.