Cutter Rig - ideas, thoughts, and suggestions

[Fintan Murphy]

Well,

I've made two sets of furling gear, and come up with the same problem that Captain Jake had. When they are used as the mast forestay, they are under too much tension to work well. So I have decided to put in a seperate forestay that will be tighter than the furling lines (wires).

By the way, initially I am clipping the furling lines (wires) to the mast and bowsprit. I am not going to have them on halyards - this may change, but for the moment it's simpler.

So I am thinking as follows. The jib, I am clipping onto the front eyebolt as per the plans. This is attached to the mast at roughly the position as per the plans. The forestay will be clipped to an eyebolt just forward of the clubfoot eyebolt plan position. This will also to to the eyebolt that the shrouds are clipped to. The inner jib (staysail?) will attach to the boom where the clubfoot eyebolt is as per the plans. This is attached to the mast at an eyebolt about a foot down from the standing rigging eyebolt.

My main concern is that I have not left enough of a "hole" for the jib to tack through. It shouldn't get cought up in the forestay, but it might.

My other concern is if I should reduce the sail measurements as per the plans as I may induce lee helm by increasing the total sail area in front of the mast.

If I was replying to myself I would say to go with a sloop rig and forget about the cutter option, but I think that there is something about a gaff rigged cutter, that just looks right. :roll:

What I'll probably do is "suck it and see", and make alterations as things don't work out. But I'd appreaciate the knowledgeable input of the board.

[capt jake]

If you install the additional sail; how are you going to control the jib? I am assuming you are going to use sheets and not the clubfoot? The jib sheets travel thrugh the 'hole'.

FWIW, my furling system is installed pretty much the way you describe. Mine is on a halyard, it is much easier to install the jib this way, IMHO.

Yes, taking the tension off of the swivels made everything work slick!

[Craig]

Hi Fintan, I too think the cutter rig looks best on the friendships and am in the process of modifying the Saralee. Checking my weekender plans it looks like your stock jib is a 100% er. I am not sure I understand what configuration you want as per the furlers; however, for (I am assuming your boat is a weekender, can

[Mike Pennington]

Well said, Craig. I actually enjoyed reading that.

I discovered something today, after no longer having a boat in the yard, there both on the lake. I got nothing to do either. I 'd go to the lake, but I have to work two more shifts. Should have brought back the boat trailer to haul steel.

Or a new mast, yeah!

Thanks, Craig, I hope you don't charge for sailing workshop therapy?

Fintan,

You follow that dream of a cutter rig, you won't regret it. Like Craig says, PICTURES.

Work a little, sail a little, the perfect combination so one dosen't exurt themselves. Now, ready for a swim?

P.S. When your over fifty, you get to wear your hair any ---- way you want to. Especially when you had fun getting that doo.

[Craig]

Never a charge for that Mke.... Now our OBGYN Clinic on Mondays.......

[Fintan Murphy]

Thanks lads for the thoughts.

I was working on the boat last night and had the mast up. It's hard to convince Irene that you are actually working on the boat, when all see sees is you sitting on a moaning chair, staring up at the mast with that far away look in your eyes. You have to explain to her to suppress her natural instinct to talk to you in this situation.

It's along the same lines as asking a mechanic if he knows what's wrong, when he has the bonnet open and is looking at the engine.

Anyway, revised plans are afoot.

I've connected up the forestay from the mast to the eyebolt where the clubfoot is connected in the plans. (Just to clear up confusion, I will be using jibsheets, not a clubfoot). This is going to be the main, and only, forestay. I am going to have the (outer) jib on the furling system, with a halyard. This is going to be connected to the eye where the forestay would be connected as per the plans.

Because of the (small) size of the inner staysail, I am going to just hank that onto the forestay (and not use a furler), and raise and lower it via another halyard.

This gives me the ability to just use the jib if I am sailing on my own. It is the same size and position as the plans, so will retain the same sail area.

When I am sailing with a buddy, or I am on my own and feel like it, I will raise the staysail and go cutter.

Pictures will be forthcoming.

Captain Jake, do you have any problems with the halyard on the furler twisting up when you are rolling, or unrolling the sail? In that it is easier for the halyard to twist rather than the shackle to swivel?

[capt jake]

Captain Jake, do you have any problems with the halyard on the furler twisting up when you are rolling, or unrolling the sail? In that it is easier for the halyard to twist rather than the shackle to swivel?

I thought there may be a problem with this, but it has not twisted at all. If it were to twist, I have seen several solutions to prevent it; basically a rod sticking out at 90 degrees to the shackle at the end of the halyard. this rod would back contact with teh upper portion of the mast, thus preventing twist.

Even when I had it incorporated into the forestay (with the excess pressure) the halyard didn't twist. It should have because the swivel was binding.

I have been really impressed thus far, as no twist. By using a halyard, if there were a failure, you can still lower the unit as well. Also the ability to change tension on the luff to desired shape. I almnost wish I could put a wee bit more pressure on it to flatten it out in heavier winds (mine is onlu a 1:1 purchase), but it is working fine.

I may experiment with it in a reefing mode today, but I don't think it will functio for this purpose.

Plan to take my Mom out today if Iget over this sinus infection.

[capt jake]

Hey Fintan; I furled and unfurled several times and watched the halyard in particular. No twist at all. It didn't even begin to try! I am assuming it is because of the tension on the line that prevents it.

Not enough wind to try to reef, barely enough to get back to port! Never did make our destination.

[Barry Pyeatt]

HI Fintan,

On those boats that I studied with this type of furling setup, those that used a fixed luff wire/headstay had some twisting issues but nothing serious according to the owners. Those that used a fixed headstay and then ran the luff wire as Capt. Jake has done it with a halyard to hoist it and control tension had virtually no twisting issues.

Conclusion on my part at least is that the fixed headstay with the furling set just behind it works out the best. So...I'm going to go that route with mine. I am planning on extending my bowsprit by 20" and allowing 18" spacing between the roller luff and the luff for the staysail.

I plan on setting the staysail on a clubfoot so it is self tending but with the clubfoot on a traveler mounted to the deck. Then routing the sheet from the block on the traveler back to the cockpit. Downhaul on the staysail also fed back to the cockpit. My staysail will be slightly smaller than the stock jib for the Weekender with a shorter clubfoot and the foot cut at a bit sharper angle than on the stock jib.

Worked with this setup on a boat in the Carrib. Worked out extremely well and the roughly 22" of clearance between the staysail luff and the Lapper luff on that boat worked out very well in tacking and handled beautifully. This was on a 26' cutter rigged gaffer that was a modified dory hull with a weighted centerboard.

Had a blast for 4 days working with this combination in a lot of different wind conditions and it was a great time.

Good luck!

[Johannah]

I'm a bit concerned about the clutter of turning blocks on the side decks with just the one jib. Where are you going to put that gear for two and cleats for all the sheets? Our boat already looks like an ad for various cleat manufacturers.

[Steve Downs]

Hi Fintan, what a pleasure it was to meet you in Killarney. I appreciate you taking to time to drive up all that way from Cork to visit. We had a wonderful time in Ireland and Great Britain and are glad to be back home again. I can't wait to see how your boat is coming along. Looking forward to the launch photos. Take care.

[Fintan Murphy]

Yea Steve, it was great to meet up.

I hope your ears weren't bleeding afterwards, as I do tend to rabbit on when I meet someone for the first time. I could tell you were fairly bushed by the end of the night, after a long day travelling.

It was great to meet yourself and Jan, and I hope the rest of your trip was as enjoyable. How was the west coast, and did you have a good time in Bunratty Castle?

I mentioned the Gaels of Laughter to my dad, who remembers them from his youth.

I had a fabulous ride home over the Cork/Kerry mountains. It was a beautiful night, with very little traffic.

When I met Frank in Kilkenny, I got a speeding ticket on the way up. As I was driving out of Killlarney, there was a cop hidden in the bushes with a speed camera. Since I was caught last time I've stayed religously to the speed limits, and it saved my bacon this time.

You'll have to come back next time for a longer visit, and a bit of boating.

[Steve Downs]

Yes we really enjoyed Bunratty Castle. When we got to Dublin we walked to the Gaiety Theater where I used to play and asked to show my wife the stage. They sent us around back to the stage door and convinced the Stage Manager to take us for a peek. They are doing "Riverdance" for the summer but they raised some props out of the way and opened the curtain for us. It was beautiful, just the way I remembered. They even had the same old pictures on the wall by the Green Room. I could have gone home right then and been happy. We did have a great trip. My wife's favorite place was Edinburgh for some reason. I'll bet it's cold there in the winter. Well, back to work. Good luck on yout boat, I'd love to come back someday and go for a wee sail. Slan.