Princess 26

[LennieG]

Howard-

Best of luck and look forward to your updates.

[Wayne Robson]

In reply to a query from Bill Ginn here's a few pics of transom slot on Twiggy P26

[maligno]

Wayne: Any particular reason for the oval cutouts in the sides of the motor well?

[Wayne Robson]

Yes, just to allow the motor to swing a little. Not enough to steer with but enough to cancel out any load on the tiller. Honda 10 has a pretty bulky head, I think a smaller motor would allow quite a good arc for steering.

[maligno]

Thanks.

[Howard]

Wow........Wayne has set the bar pretty high for the Princess builders. That is some quality work. His photos go a long way to helping visualize some of the build features.....his modifications and the build in general. Hope he has more and keeps posting them.

 

I had origionally started out thinking 6 hp, for this, but a smooth running twin with an alternator also seemed like a good idea. To get that, most motors bump you into the 8 to 9.9 hp category and since the 9.9 is the same basic motor as the 8, and judging from the options if far and away the most popular motor, looks like the 9.9 is going to be the motor of choice.

[Howard]

Decided to try casting a second lead tip with the new and improved sand recipe, which was a definate improvement over the first effort, but still not happy with it. Based on that experience, I even cast a THIRD tip, thinking the third time would be a charm. It wasn't. What I was hoping for was a flawless tip that didn't require much fairing. Not sure if what I was doing is that far wrong, but I quickly decided the best thing to do was to stop casting and start fairing to see what I had. Turns out, both of the last two attempts yielded servicable tips. This really isn't rocket surgery.

 

Both of the last two tips were cast with the sand still pretty wet, which gave both a very smooth, very firm mold that did not even hint of a pop or any indication of steam. Still, for some strange reason, the lead mixed into the sides to leave a rough texture. I can think of a lot of reasons why this might be, but as long as the flaw is to the outside and not inside, that can be faired off. One thing the wetter sand mix did do was cool the lead faster (both during the pour and after). The thinner sections on the leading and trailing edges were setting up faster than I could ladle it over. I was a little concerned about it, but the main core was poured in one piece. If you could pour it all at once, those little score marks would go away. I wasn't able to horse 60 pounds of molten lead over to the casting box, so stuck with the ladle process, at least in the beginning. About halfway full, I was able to pour in the rest.

 

The first pour took about 8 hours to cool down enough to handle. The two wetter mixes were able to handle in about 2 hours. In all cases, the vertical shaped casting ended up shrinking in the middle. The last one.....a lot. The void is nearly 1/4" deep. After spending an hour or so on the third casting, I decided to clean up the 2nd to see what I had. It will end up being the pick of the litter. A much better shape.

 

I've heard lead is easy to shape and work, and that is somewhat the case. You can shape and work it with normal hand tools. I keep a cheap, box store plane and set of beater chisels for this type of work and they did the trick. The chisel was used to trim off the tabs on the bottom. With those off, the plane quickly takes the sides down to flush. Also used a surform plane for the finer detail work. Coarse sandpaper will work to scuff it to give it the tooth it will need to adhear to epoxy.

 

Next step will be to fit it and attach it to the board, prior to glassing.

[Howard]

The tip of the spear. Looks like it fits. Once glassed on, should be OK. Since the total board will weigh about 80 pounds, I figure next step is to prep the trunk before glassing this together, as that will be a heavy board to be horsing around as you work to line up the holes for the pivot pin.

 

BTW, finished weight of the tip was exactly 50 pounds. Amazing.

[wkisting]

It looks great!

 

FWIW, I would want to 'glass the board before prepping the trunk. You'll want to know the final thickness of the board before you prep the trunk, won't you? That way you can get the trunk width/spacing exactly right.

[Howard]

My reason for starting on the trunk now is the CB pivot pin hole and holes on either side of the trunk have to line up square. I figure that will require fitting the CB and trunk pieces together........probably several times to get them as square as possible. That and getting the lifting tackle installation lined out. I think all that will be easier with the board as it is now (30 pounds) vs. wrestling an 80 pound board around once it is fully put together. And I will fully put the CB together prior to the final glue up of the CB trunk. Prior to that, I'll leave the king planks at least 1/4" over width and plan on shaving them to fit at the very last moment.

 

Speaking of the trunk, plans call for 1" x 7 1/4" doublers be installed on the trunk sides to help support the loads on the CB pivot pin. That is a full 1" and not a nominal 1 x 8. Since nobody in these parts sells anything 5/4 but treated deck lumber, my choices are to mill down 1 1/2" stock (probably to 1 1/4"), or option B (if they are strong enough), is to laminate these up from light / dark woods and leave them bright, as they will be a conspicuous part of the interior.  If so, I'd do the same thing with the rails. Interesting how even now, no farther along than I am, I get to start making choices that will affect the appearence forever.

 

BTW, it recently occured to me the fully finished CB is going to wind up weighing almost the same as the 9.9 hp outboard that pushes the boat around. That board is a beast.

[Dale Niemann]

Many real lumber yards carry 5/4 stair treads.  You might try to find them.

dale

[Howard]

Dale:

 

Good advice on the stair treads. Not sure why I didn't think of that, especially since I already have one hiding in plain open site. Bought it years ago intending to use it for knees and breast hook on the Spindrift. While that would cover the doublers (as designed) I'd still be in the hunt for rails which are over 6' long. Plans are in conflict and show both 1" x 1.5" and 1" x 2" (full dimensions). Spoke with Graham and I now think I'll up both to 1 1/4" to beef them up. So I can get these out of nominal 2" x 8" stock, which I already have. This is MSR (machine stress rated) yellow pine. These will be used for tabernacles, but are long enough, the cutoffs can be used for my doublers.

 

Plywood I'm using for this build is BS 1088 Hydrotek (meranti). Aside from being called Hydrotek, I've never seen reference to any of the mills or manufacturers (such Joubert for Okume). Was curious what mine would turn out to be. The 1/2" has a Fuji stamp on it. The rest all have Dragon. Meranti all looks to be from Asia, and hopefully Indonesia and not China. Having never used meranti for anything, wasn't sure what I would find, but it looks to be OK. Will do a boil test on some scraps, but so far, no complaints.

 

Speaking of tabernacles, I seem to recall that after center piece split on Pilgram (Travis's Princess 22), there is a recommended grain orientation for the center piece. Not sure which it is.......vertical or flat grain. Also, again, early on, you get to decided aluminum or wood masts, as the width of the center tabernacle piece varies, depending on which you chose. I'm going with aluminum, so mine will be 4" for the main and 3" for the mizzen.

 

 

 

[Howard]

A Princess in raw form. (never been too impressed with my cell phone camera).

 

Never have thought this was going to be a big job until I had to move most of that pile to get to the 5/8" stuff on the bottom. About half the way through that it finally dawned on me that somebody has to measure, cut, trim, epoxy, sand, and paint or varnish all those pieces before this pile of plywood turns into a boat.

 

I guess the best way to treat this is like eating an elephant. You start with the first bite...............

[Wayne Robson]

Don't worry Howard, a large percentage turns to sawdust or scrap!

[Howard]

One looming setback seems to have been averted. Another showed up.

 

First on the plywood: The 5/8" Hydrotek has the Fuji stamp on it. Did a little reasearch and that product seems to be made in China. Strike one came when I noticed that maybe half of the panels had small patches of a putty like material on the faces. None of them major, but if you wanted to finish the panel bright, you would not want to see that. Strike two was when I cut the first panel down and found some weird laminations in the middle......as if some of the alternating laminations were not oriented 90 degrees. Not all the way through, but for short stretches. No major voids, but the occasional hole about the same length as the lamination width. Having seen that, I decided a boil test was in order (I'm now thinking a boil test is ALWAYS in order). After an hour, a small delamination appeared. That would be strike 3. Looked like all my 5/8" was going to have to go back, and that would be a setback. But since the delamination was along the edge, where it would be possible to have damaged the edge from handling, I figured I'd better try a more extensive boil test as I'd likely need more proof in order to return it to the supplier. So I cut up 5 more test blocks and hard boiled them for 6 hours. None of them had even the slightest hint of an additional delimaination. Structurally, seems to be sound and since very little of the 5/8" will be finished bright, and can be worked around if it is, looks like I will keep and use it. BUT, if I buy any more Meranti Hydrotek, I'll ask about the brand and if it is the Fuji, I'll pass on it.

 

I think we all understand that the BS 1088 standard is more of a guideline than a rule (a set of published standards that are not enforced by anyone), but if you are going to market and sell a product with that stamp on it, it needs to live up to the standard. The standard is what it is and if they are not able or willing to meet the standard, the only enforcement mechanism users have are each other. It is up to us spread the word. My advice is to buy something other than the Fuji if you can. By the way, so far, the panels with the Dragon stamp on them seem to be OK. The laminations all look good and no voids or patches I can see. Some panels do have a lot of grain in them.

 

While I was at it, I decided to boil a lot of other stuff to see what would happen. Most held together ine. These were 3/4" marine fir, plain old ACX exterior fir, birch plywood, Joubert Okume and the Dragon brand of Meranti. Several hours in boiling water and no delaminations at all.

 

Two samples of what I new to be junk were also tried and they didn't last 30 minutes. Hope we never get to the point where this is all there is. The thin stuff is what they now sell as underlayment for vinyl floors. Used to be luan, which wasn't great, but by comparison, was far and away a much better product.

 

[Howard]

After cutting out the plywood panels for the CB trunk, started looking for the structural wood for the rails, doublers, king planks, etc. As noted, I was intending to use yellow pine for this. Yellow pine is some amazingly strong stuff......I can see why they make scaffold planks out of it......but it also appears to have some issues with checks and splitting.

 

Back when I was gluing up the CB, I rejected one of the potential staves, as it had a check in it that ran all the way to the end. Over time, that check widened to a full blown split as it dried down. When I started looking, all the boards I had intended to use for the tabernacles also have these checks in them. All appear to be running 90 degrees to the rings, or straight out from the center of the tree to the edge. Since all of these boards were flat sawn, all are developing checks and splits in them on the apex of the flat sawn edge. Since I am going to need at least 6 inches of board for the tabernacles, and 7 inches plus for my doublers, I'm not sure I'm willing to put these boards in there knowing they are splitting to start with.  I think boards like this used for the tabernacles will split (running off the wind, the leverage of the mast is fore and aft, not sideways). I would fear a split even if heavily glassed, inside and out.

 

A better choice would seem to be boards with a leaning or vertical grain, but so far, I have not been able to find them wide enough to avoid a flat sawn spot. Option B, if strong enough, would be to laminate these up from thinner stock. Laminations, if finished bright, would look better anyway. My only concern is if the laminated pieces would be strong enough? If so, I could do this for both the tabernacles and doublers on the CB trunk.

 

Lastly, for the tabernacles anyway, in addition to glassing them inside and out, I may borrow a trick they use on those scaffolding planks where they insert metal pins on the ends to prevent them from splitting. I'd guess a piece of 3/16" or 1/4" stainless all thread rod bedded in epoxy would keep a solid piece or lamination from splitting apart?

 

Yet another option for the doublers would be to laminate those from plywood? Two layers of 5/8" makes them 1 1/4" wide on top of the 5/8" ply sides. I can't imagine that blowing apart.

 

 

[Howard]

Setbacks aside, got pretty far along with the CB trunk. Cutting plywood goes a lot faster than shaping CB's and casting lead.

 

Anyway, plans show a triangle shaped arrangement for the king planks in the aft end of the trunk. If left as is, that would leave a void of air. I'm inclined to fill that out of fear that somehow, someway, water would get in there. One option is to add more king plank filler pieces and epoxy them in solid. Other option is to fit and fill in a piece of pink foam panel, cut and fit to shape. My natural inclination is to go the wood route, but that adds weight and I doubt it is needed for any structural purpose.

[wkisting]

If it were me, I'd drill a small drain hole (1/8") at the bottom tip of the triangle to drain out into the cockpit. That way, any water that gets in can get out. That seems the simplest, lightest solution and the least likely to promote rot if your concerns about water intrusion are warranted.

 

The other possibility--and probably the one I would actually choose--is just to be fairly liberal with the thickened epoxy when you bond the case together, and then carefully use a shaped stick (or some kind of makeshift tool) to reach down inside the case after assembly to create small fillets along the insides edges of the case. That should negate any likelihood of water intrusion also. You'll just need to be careful to clean up any mess to keep the inside of the case smooth before the epoxy hardens. [Edit to add: You could do the fillets on one side of the case before assembly, obviously, to make it easier. But the other side would need the shaped stick treatment.]

[805gregg]

Originally I was having Graham design my 28 with an outboard well. My plan was to have a 25 or 30 in there to run all the river systems to get to the Gulf and for all other reasons you have. One big one was the ability to remove the outboard completely for maintenance or major breakdown issues, which would be rare with the reliability of modern outboards.

The only real down side for me was the lack of a real alternator. If we will be living on this boat for 4 to 6 months a year I needed a real charging system. Then Graham found me this Beta 20 with a 60 amp alternator and only 160 hours on the diesel. So we promptly switched over to the Beta from the outboard. Another plus to the Beta is economic. The very helpful folks at Beta told me the 20 should push my 28 at hull speed with a fuel consumption of a half a gallon an hour. That works out to around 14 mpg.

 

I've got a Bristol Channel Cutter with a 15hp Yanmar and it uses 1 Qt an hr at hull speed, you should get better than 1/2 gal per hr

[Howard]

Got a chance to rip down the rails for the top of the CB trunk. Going into the planer, they were 2 1/4" x 1 1/2". Coming out of the planer, they were 1 1/4" x 2" and looked flimsy by comparison. But once on the trunk, they look massively large. Also, laminated up a doubler, which seems to have developed a split in one of the staves, so it may not be much more than practice, but gives one an idea of what it is supposed to look like.

 

Also, on the front end of the CB trunk, I may add a cap in front of the king post. Plans call for two of the simple eye straps......one as a dead eye for the lifting tackle pennant and the other for the blocks. With screws set into epoxy, they may be strong enough. Option B would be to use an eye bolt as will be used on the CB end, extending through the intial king post into another one set in front of it. A doubler for the king post, so to speak. But if the pull on both is the same on both fasteners, adding one eye bolt doesn't help. Really would be helpful to know how much strain the CB lifting tackle is going to generate.

 

Did some tests and each layer of 17 oz biaxial adds 1/32" in thickness. With a single layer on each side of the trunk and one on both sides of the CB, that adds 1/8". I am currently at 7/16" so if glassed as is, I'd finish at 5/16". That is about 1/8" over the suggested goal of 3/16". These are the times when I get nervous. Easy to take more wood off........not so easy to put it back on. Inclined to leave it as is and if filler is needed to tighten up the slot, I can always double up on the glass below the waterline.