backward weekender

[markfitz]

We've worked on this boat for over 7 years and it took us until just the other day to realize we built our weekender backwards!  Actually, when figuring out how to get it on the trailer (which we haven't done yet) we realized how much easier this task would have been if we didn't build the boat with the bow facing away from the garage door!    :-[

Anyway, assuming we can find a few volunteers to help us haul this boat out of the garage and turn it around, my question has to do with the eyebolt or U bracket or whatever one would mount somewhere on the front of the boat to connect the trailer winch to -- I didn't see anything in the plans, and I wasn't sure exactly what to call that thing so my searches were wildly unsuccessful.  I'm assuming that should probably be drilled right through the entire keel with a giant washer on the inside.  Is that how most others have done it?  

Also, I remember reading somewhere about a keel saver technique -- some sort of sacrificial strip along the keel that was replaceable.  Would it be a good idea to include something like that, or is it just asking for trouble screwing into the keel?

[Charlie Jones]

It's called a "bow eye". How I install them is pretty simple. I use the U-bolt style with two legs. Put two nuts on each leg, one at the end of the threads and one about 1/2 inch from the other thread end, towards the bend. Bore two holes so that the nuts will slip in, deeply enough for the plate to seat when it's inserted all the way. Then fill the holes with thickened epoxy, insert the U-bolt, refilling as needed and tape it to the stem til the epoxy cures.

You can then ( and I have) pick up the boat with that bow eye- it ISN'T coming out.

In fact I built a Princess 22 for a customer and that's how we held the boat up while installing the 400 pound ballast pig and also while running the trailer underneath.

[Konrad]

Charlie,

You got any tricks for him on how to get thickened epoxy up in there, in an upright boat?

I use plastic syringes that you can get from pharmacies for thin epoxy sometimes on other things, but not sure if that would work on thickened epoxy in an inverted situation.

K

[Andrew_Butchart]

If you check, in the plans they have you drill a monsterous hole through the side of the keel for winching and the painter.

For me - when I built the keel I embedded one of the long welded eye eyebolts that they use to attach guy wires to hydro poles (from the farm supply store).  It goes right through the keel with a wing-nut in the middle (no comments please Konrad) and a nut and washer on the inside.  To "waterproof" it, I filled the hole with roof patch compound.

Afterwards I found that the eye was too small to hold the hook for the boat winch which I "solved" by adding in a large quicklink for heavy chain.

[Frank Hagan]

I found a bow eye in a surplus place and drilled a hole half way through the stem on the port side, then drilled from the stem back into the hole to place the bow eye.  I epoxied it in place, and then filled the hole in the side.

Charlie's method is the one to use ... its easy, and just as strong as any of the alternatives.  When you mix the epoxy, add enough wood flour or fumed silica to make a pretty heavy paste, spoon it in with a popsicle stick, insert the eye, spoon some more epoxy in and then use cellophane or PVC packing tape to hold it in place while it cures.  When its cured, the tape pulls right off the epoxy, and its smooth underneath.

[PAR]

Place the bow eye as low on the stem as you can. Get it very close to the LWL as possible. It will make loading and unloading at the ramp a lot easier.

I usually bond bow eye shanks in place before I run the nuts down. To keep the goo from running down the outside of the stem, I run a bead of caulk around the shank on the outside and let it cure overnight. I then squirt epoxy into the holes from the other side and let gravity do what it always does. The caulk keeps the stem clean, the epoxy hardens and I run the nuts home.

[Charlie Jones]

Konrad- you can put the thickened epoxy, however thick you want it, into a baggie. Then clip off one corner and use it like a cake decorator to squeeze epoxy into the hole. As you push the bow eye in, with it's nut attached, epoxy will ooze out. Just squeeze more in until it's all filled.

Then seal it up as Frank outlined. I like using the packing tape

Then just throw the baggie away.

[Bill Paxton]

Here's a link to how I protected the keel on my Weekender using a strip of aluminum.

http://www.messing-about.com/forums/index.php?topic=3402.0

[John Weigandt]

Don't drill the big painter hole in the stem.. it will expose end grain and even if painted , will admit water.

I had to replace the whole stem on mine last year.  water in the hole, and water from the top between the laminations seeped in and rotted out the whole affair.

I would highly reccomend putting a strip of glass/ epoxy over the very top of the stem (where the bowsprit will rest) 

Another place where water seeped in was the long bold holding the sprit in place.  Seal that puppy up with some sort of googe.

It took 10 years, but the stem turned to mush. 

John

[markfitz]

Thanks, everyone! Good stuff.

[Greg Luckett]

.....It took 10 years, but the stem turned to mush. 

John

John, what sort of wood was it made from?

Thanks.

[John Weigandt]

The keel and stem were made from Douglas Fir that had been planed down for me by the local lumber company.  I picked the best 2x12's that i could find and the guy planed them down to 3/4 for me (I'm sure with a tear in his eye).    We just didn't have any quality 1x stock in town at all.. even 11 years ago.

I'm sure that just about any wood short of Teak would have rotted by now given the same circumstances/ construction.

My keel was also laminated with the Weldwood glue...  I hadn't obtained my epoxy trial kit at the time...  Weldwood will let water intrusion slowly leech it away, penetrate, and migrate to other laminations.  I looked carefully as I stripped away the rot, and examined the old lamination interfaces.  I would never build with weldwood again.. given it's lack of flexibility, and leaching charachteristics.

If I had it all to do over,  I'd use epoxy everywhere on this boat.  I did use epoxy and glass over the outside of the hull.

The keel seems to be fine when I probe it..  I was just the victim of unseen rot that went on for years in the core of the stem before I finally pressure washed and it revealed itself.

I also had a similar problem with the original rudder eyebolt down on the back of the keel.. I did the "bore a hole and use a nut to hold it" thing long before I built more boats and knew better. 

The hole was a source of water intrusion, chronic moisture etc... So quite a few years back, I chiseled out, cut in some scrap and epoxied in place with an epoxy / wood flour mix.  New rudder bolt went in with a straight bolt and epoxy as suggested by Charlie Jones. 

Broke the rudder box at BEER a few years back too from lack of inspection/ poor construction/ and rot.  I am much more cognisant of water intrusion than I used to be, but you learn from your mistakes, and hopefully folks will learn from mine.

I think the original decision to NOT encase the keel in glass is probably why the boat is still alive at 11 years old now.  it may get wet, but it can drain and dry.

I also have my original Mini cup... Now 25 years old... Polyester resin, bondo, construction adhesive....  closed chambers...  Had some deck rot repair, but still a sound boat.

Most recent boat, the summer breeze is polyurethane construction adhesive construction, along with some rubber concrete sealant for internal waterproofing  (again water from above is the enemy... rain...not the lake will kill the boat)

John