kydocfrog Posted December 8, 2005 Report Share Posted December 8, 2005 There is a neat article on Duckworks Mag from a father and son who are building a Welsford Rifleman. Heck of an article, but I also noticed one really clever detail. They have cut a cockpit grate out of what appears to be the white plastic trellis/screen sort of stuff you get at the big box stores. It may be temporary for them during construction, but actually it looks kind of neat and professional. Not as thick as a full blown teak and all, but hey... Meanwhile, winter and all that has forced Charlie Girl II into the garage for the nonce. Sigh. DocA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave R1 Posted December 8, 2005 Report Share Posted December 8, 2005 That is an interesting idea. I had pine 1x4s raised up off the bottom about an inch. They were my quick version of a cockpit grate. I took them out this past summer because they made it difficult to clean and sop up water. I'd like to do something different but have yet to decide what. Might be a teak grate. I wonder if that plastic will get slippery when wet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Fleming Posted December 9, 2005 Report Share Posted December 9, 2005 Teak Grate making is not rocket science tho a bit on the tedious side. Lots o'Ripping and Dadoing. Making a good fitting template or pattern out of 3/8ths inch MDF and layout the border pieces then fill in the actual grate strip locations. 1 inch finished thickness stock is fine. The border pieces should be spline mitered. Googe( gasp ) especially formulated for Teak, you're on your way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Hagan Posted December 9, 2005 Report Share Posted December 9, 2005 I wouldn't think the egg-crate style light diffusers would last very long ... they are polystyrene and degrade quickly in UV. Dave's thoughts on making a grate sound like the way to go to me ... I played around with a small grate on top of the bowsprit on my Weekender, and had a bit of fun making it. Took way too long, but I think the second time around it would be faster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAR Posted December 9, 2005 Report Share Posted December 9, 2005 I've made grates in the traditional egg crate layout, but now prefer a much simpler way. I use fore and aft pieces on the bottom and athwartship on top, both of the same dimensions. They are screwed together from underneath at the intersections. They don't have quite the traditional look, but are a lot easier to build, are stronger and easier to layout. These pieces have no dattos. The last one was on a bigger boat and the molded size was 5/4", sided 1 1/2" on 3" centers with a 2" boarder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umop_apisdn Posted December 9, 2005 Report Share Posted December 9, 2005 It seems to me these grates would be subject to a lot of wear and tear. What kind of finish do you put on the grates? Just varnish? do you "paint" them with epoxy first to seal them? carefully glass them over with teeny tiny strips of glass? :-D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Fleming Posted December 9, 2005 Report Share Posted December 9, 2005 TEAK is left bare for good traction. Haven't had one fail....yet? I cannot see putting a finish other than say a coat or two of Dalys SeaFin Teak Oil on a grate anything more than that and you negate the 'footing factor' of bare Teak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Pyeatt Posted December 9, 2005 Report Share Posted December 9, 2005 If you choose a different wood than Teak and most will due to the expense of Teak and lack of common sources, then there are some other considerations. I believe Phil Gowens made his grating with just strips of thinner material laid into the fore/aft thicker strips which had dados cut into them. The result is that the grate doesn't require intelocking and sets on the fore/aft "runners". This makes for a less complicated construction as well as less exposed edges to worry about. A good finish for other materials would be boiled linseed oil/turpentine mix heated and heating the wood first so the mixture is pulled into the exposed grain of the wood as it cools. This seals it up and prevents a lot of moisture from being drawn into the grain of th wood. It also leaves a good gripping surface with natural wood grain. Additonal applications of oil perodically will help to maintain a good protected surface. Soft and easy on the bare feet as well. Varnish will add some protection but needs stripping and re application pretty regularly to maintain it and a pain to do with interlocking strips of wood. Epoxy doesn't have any UV protection so needs to be coated with somehting else to protect it. Paint generally will chip and crack with expansion and contraction of the wood grating. Also a pain to remove to recoat. Watco Oil Finish also works fine. Some practical wood alternatives might be Mahogany due to its even consistent grain and less expansion/contraction with seasonal changes. You want to select as straight a grain as possible and preferrably quarter sawn stock. I would avoid anything like Oak, Ash, Hickory where the wood expands and contracts with the seasonal changes more than with other woods. Elm, Black Locust, Cypress, Redwood anc Cedar will work well. Making an interlocking grating isn't all that difficult and can be done with a router and a simple jig to make consistently even dados in the material. I have an example of the techique shown in an article in "Gaff Rig" on a bow pulpit I made for my Weekender "Spirit Wind. I'm also doing a removable cockpit grating essentially the same way. For anyone interested the link to the article is below: http://byyb.org/gaffrig/jas05/table%20of%20contents.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Fleming Posted December 9, 2005 Report Share Posted December 9, 2005 Just how big an area are we talking about here? When you say Mahagony what kind are you referring to? I wouldn't use that Philippine stuff as it is a collection of different varieties of a Cedar, not very sturdy for continued walking on, IMOOP. 'nuther way to do it....really the old way. :wink: Instead of epoxiee, wasn't borned yet. We would screw each join from underneath! Mitred corners were fastened with slip dovetails. Verrah Verrah tedious work usually done by one fellow who specialzied it making 'em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Jones Posted December 9, 2005 Report Share Posted December 9, 2005 You might also consider Ipe as a Teak substitute. Chuck has used that lattice in several boats, seemingly with good success. Here's a pic of him bailing his Ladybug after an intentional capsize at the 2004 Duckworks Messabout here at our home beach. He and Sandra sailed that boat to the 2004 Redneck Riviera Cruise that Laura and I sponser and the lattice was doing very well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Luckett Posted December 11, 2005 Report Share Posted December 11, 2005 You might also consider Ipe as a Teak substitute.Chuck has used that lattice in several boats' date=' seemingly with good success. Here's a pic of him bailing his Ladybug after an intentional capsize at the 2004 Duckworks Messabout here at our home beach. He and Sandra sailed that boat to the 2004 Redneck Riviera Cruise that Laura and I sponser and the lattice was doing very well.[/quote'] Charlie, I had forgotten about the Redneck Riviera Cruise and did not realize you and Laura were sponsers. Is this a yearly thing? Send or post some details for me about it, please. Thanks, Greg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottWidmier Posted December 12, 2005 Report Share Posted December 12, 2005 How about making grates out of that plastic lumber sold for making maintenance free decks (off of houses?). I know that stuff is heavy but for a grate it shouldn't be too bad. It is made for good traction and you won't get any splinters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kydocfrog Posted December 12, 2005 Author Report Share Posted December 12, 2005 You know, for a boat that used stock dimension lumber for framing, that stuff might be interesting. I wonder how it bends when ripped down from the 2x dimensions that it is normally sold in. Like you say, heavy, but darn near indestructible. DocA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt jake Posted December 12, 2005 Report Share Posted December 12, 2005 It does swell with moisture changes. Fasteners doen't take to it well either, though screws will hold if you don't over tighten them. It cuts and mills very easily. It is also blazin' expensive! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Pyeatt Posted December 12, 2005 Report Share Posted December 12, 2005 We made a 6'X8' grate from the recycled plastic deck material. Where we left the rough factory surface it was fine. If you use a cut surface it is slick when it gets wet. So we had all rough surfaces on the top and spaced on 1" grid. Had to screw the entire grate together to get it to hold although we tried some of the P & L commercial adhesives. Then screw it down to the sole beneath it as it wasn't a wall to wall grate so it slid around too much otherwise. There are better and more cost effective non-slip deck products available now that just drop in place and interlock with each other. That was about 10-12 years ago and last I heard it is holding up well on a work boat. Don't know why it wouldn't be Ok for our use other than the expense which is considerable Cut edges don't accept stains or hold paint well over time so they get a bit ugly. I was considering the 1X2 stock at Lowes for rub rails for awhile until I priced it out. Then decided I could rip some hand pulled 2 X stock to size and round over the edges and be more cost effective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Jones Posted December 13, 2005 Report Share Posted December 13, 2005 Greg- it has been yearly so far- We've done the trip for four years now and sponsered the Redneck Riviera Cruise for 2. We attend the "doing it on the deck" concert put on by a Texas Musician named Larry Joe Taylor, held every year at the Port Lavaca city marina. We then leave on Saturday AM for the sail down Matagorda Bay to Pass Cavallo, the natural pass out into the gulf. That's about an 18 - 20 mile sail. We usually have a pot luck on the beach that night and then watch the Port O'Conner fireworks display from 3 miles across the water. The next morning we up anchor and sail around into Espritu Santos bay, to the (used to be) Matagorda Island State Park. It isn't a state park any longer but the free docks are still there. We kick around the island the remainder of the day, some walking over to the beach ( 2 miles) some fishing, whatever. Then on Monday we sail back to Port Lavaca for taking out boats, etc. We normally set two routes for the Saturday sail- one for small boats and the other for deeper draft vessels. So far the weather has been just great on that weekend, although the year before we began the cruises Laura and I got the stuffing stomped out of us down there- 5 thunderstorms during the night with winds in the first one approaching 50 knots. It's all wide open waters and wide open, primitive anchorages, so it can get rough. People who come should really be able to sail their boats, and have totally adequate anchoring gear- it could be needed. Here's what our house and yard looked like just before the 2004 cruise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Luckett Posted December 13, 2005 Report Share Posted December 13, 2005 Charlie, That sounds like a lot of fun. Maybe the year after next I will be ready to trailer Nellie down to Texas. I think I will need at least 2 weeks of vacation and some serious planning for that sort of trip. Wish I had that PS26 built as it would be ideal. Greg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Luckett Posted March 6, 2006 Report Share Posted March 6, 2006 I've made grates in the traditional egg crate layout' date=' but now prefer a much simpler way. I use fore and aft pieces on the bottom and athwartship on top, both of the same dimensions. They are screwed together from underneath at the intersections. They don't have quite the traditional look, but are a lot easier to build, are stronger and easier to layout. These pieces have no dattos. The last one was on a bigger boat and the molded size was 5/4", sided 1 1/2" on 3" centers with a 2" boarder.[/quote']You wouldn't happen to have a picture of this, that you might share with us, would you? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAR Posted March 7, 2006 Report Share Posted March 7, 2006 I'll look around for a picture of the grating, but it's little more then a set of athwartship slats on fore and aft runners with a boarder. They just lift out for cleaning, so should be a loose fit. Another lumber to use would be pitch pine, though doesn't wear as well as teak, it was common on work boat decks in the Chesapeake when I was a boy, because it was cheap and available. It was lightly oiled (often) and tolerated the cleated boots, dropped equipment and other rough treatment of work boat life. I use pitch pine for deck hatches pretty regularly, cutting it into strips and laminating them to plywood backs with polysulfide in the seams. It's also good if you want to make your own pine tar. I've played with some of the "plastic" lumber sold at Lowes/Depot and haven't been impressed. It doesn't take fasteners well, but I found machine screws work better then wood (she made me install a fence around the A/C units). It doesn't glue that I know of, but it may be possible to weld the stuff. The colors are not what I like to see, slippery when wet or covered in fish goo and it looks sterile, alien or not particularly inviting to my eye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Luckett Posted March 7, 2006 Report Share Posted March 7, 2006 A fellow boat builder (building a 48' Diesel Duck) told me Saturday that Ash is going for about $0.50/bdft here now, but I do not think it would be good for exposed usage. The state is cutting thousands of ash trees to try and stop the emerald ash borer. Seems dumb as heck to me....typical govt.....it is not working but absolutely insures the 100% destruction of the ash trees including any that might of been resistant. Sorry for the rant. I am thinking of using White Oak or Sassafras, which are locally available for about $1.50/bdft. Both woods are very durable and good for boat use. I can find Black Walnut for about $2/bdft too. I do not know what pitch pine is exactly and wonder if it is called something else which might be locally available too. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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