Welsh4life Posted March 8, 2020 Report Share Posted March 8, 2020 I'm down to the last of my kayak! I'm using Rust-Oleum Oil based enamel to paint it. The paint is going on like sweatpants after supper. My question is how many layers should I put on and is there a way to check if it will float before I go out to the lake? On a side note, if you ever feel like you'd want to an entire store to think you are off your paddle, walk into a Sherwin WIlliams store and ask to buy oil based paint for a polyester kayak. They were amused to say the least. They wouldn't sell me any paint and I left with my tail between my legs! Walked across the road to Lowes, kept my mouth shut and left with paint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hirilonde Posted March 8, 2020 Report Share Posted March 8, 2020 4 hours ago, Welsh4life said: On a side note, if you ever feel like you'd want to an entire store to think you are off your paddle, walk into a Sherwin WIlliams store and ask to buy oil based paint for a polyester kayak. They were amused to say the least. They wouldn't sell me any paint and I left with my tail between my legs! Wow, I went to Sherwin Williams and told them the same story. They recommended their oil based porch and deck enamel and told me they could mix it in any of the bazillion colors offered and would color match if I had a sample. It is what I use when the basics offered by Rustoleum won't foot the bill. My boats still float. I did 3 coats, though some say 2 is usually enough. I thin the first one and not the last 2. Paint companies today are quite good at producing to the proper viscosity. I don't mess unless I am using the paint as a primer and want additional penetration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kudzu Posted March 8, 2020 Report Share Posted March 8, 2020 Depends on how you paint, but 3 coats is what I do. The reason I say this, I had a student in my first class that put his paint on thin and I didn't realize it. Took it the water and it leaked like a sieve! Everyone has used a quart to paint theirs and he had half of his quart left. He added another two coats and wrote me it was fine then. But that was embarrassing for me and him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welsh4life Posted March 9, 2020 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2020 Thanks! I knocked out the first coat with thinner. Went on like a dream. Second and third layer were smooth. Thanks for the Youtube videos and forum help. The longshot is using quite a bit of paint due to its size. I am managing to keep the weave in sight and not filling the weave. Thanks for the help and quick answers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kudzu Posted March 9, 2020 Report Share Posted March 9, 2020 Filling the weave is related to epoxy and fiberglass cloth and not paint. You keep applying epoxy to get a smoother surface. This is a fabric boat, not fiberglass and people mix the two up all the time but paint is not epoxy. It is thin film coating and if put on like epoxy, thick enough to fill the weave it will crack and peel off eventually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Posted March 10, 2020 Report Share Posted March 10, 2020 I used Rustoleum (actually Ace Hardware's private label version made by Rustoleum). Seemed to go on really well, did 3 or 4 coats, but then noticed that the skin had slackened. It was drum tight before painting and now I can see diagonal ripples in the hull, and the deck feels "soft." My boat is a Castaway, and the fabric was the heavy weight stuff. Not real pleased with the outcome, it's a "twenty footer." Not the ideal boat that I wanted, but as someone said, it's a boat, not a piano. I get photos tomorrow when I'm in the workshop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Posted March 10, 2020 Report Share Posted March 10, 2020 Here's a representative photo. All four quarters of the hull look like this, plus the bottom of the hull is slightly floppy. I re-shrunk the whole boat prior to painting, just to be sure everything was a snug as possible. Are other people having a problem with the 9 ounce material? I thought I did everything as I was supposed to - including the use of Rustoleum oil based, high gloss paint. Rolled it on, and here's what I got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kudzu Posted March 11, 2020 Report Share Posted March 11, 2020 First off, I am getting some emails with issues with several coatings relaxing the fabric. I suspect what is happening is too much dependence on shrinking the fabric and for whatever reason the finishes are just relaxing the fabric back to it's pre-shrunk state. I have done a video showing how I sew on a skin tight but I am sure it's not easy for the first timer. I pretty sure if you start with a tight skin it will stay tight. Boats I have skinned and painted don't have this problem and I sew my skins drum tight. The only shrinking is typical just a few wrinkles around the coaming. But I am aware of this but not sure what to do. I am debating if I want to continue to sell this fabric or not. Problem is the other options are substantially more expensive. The premium fabric is a better fabric but it costs me well over $1,000 per rol. The is a slower seller because of the price. Everyone wants cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Posted March 11, 2020 Report Share Posted March 11, 2020 (edited) First let me say that I love the whole SOF concept, feel very satisfied with the kit and support I got from Jeff, and in no way am I maligning Kudzu. If memory serves, I had to get the 9 oz fabric because the Castaway design is too beam-y for the premium, lighter fabric. I would gladly have paid the premium if the lighter fabric would have been wide enough for my boat. I sewed it a tight as possible, starting over several times to get it right. In fact, I sewed the center seam around 3/16" fiberglass rods rather than using paracord for the corded stitch. I tried it with paracord and couldn't get a decently straight line. The fiberglass rods gave me real leverage to allow me to get it super tight and gave me a straight seam. I pulled the artificial sinew to breaking point multiple times between each end and the cockpit. Not fun starting the next stitches. Do not copy this process unless you have the persistence of a hungry puppy - it's a major pain in the butt, and will lead to much frustration, yelling, and occasional swearing. I ran an experiment on shrinking the 9 oz fabric. Marked a 6" + on a scrap, then ironed and steamed it until there was no more movement. The most I got was about 5/8" over the 6 inches of the +, and that only in one direction. The other dimension was less the 1/4" of shrinkage. So, I knew I couldn't rely on shrinking to get it tight. It was TIGHT before I ironed it. So, it's like I said, it's not a piano, it's a boat that I intend to use daily - the photo below is where I get to live here in South Florida. I plan on using that Castaway daily to paddle and fish, wrinkles be damned. My only point in raising this whole wrinkle issues is to alert the community that there may be a more generalized problem than just Zar on the 9 oz fabric, one that extends to the most trusted and recommended of finishes for these boats, Rustoleum. Edited March 11, 2020 by von wrong word 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kudzu Posted March 11, 2020 Report Share Posted March 11, 2020 39 minutes ago, von said: My only point in raising this whole wrinkle issues is to alert the community that there may be a more generalized problem than just Zar on the 9 oz fabric, one that extends to the most trusted and recommended of finishes for these boats, Rustoleum. And I am beginning to think the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Conway Posted October 22, 2020 Report Share Posted October 22, 2020 Okay I ended up with the same results using the 9 oz fabric and Rustoleum. I really thought I had the skin on tight, I busted 50 pound test braided fishing line a few times. I did not heat shrink expect for a few wrinkles around the coming. To be honest I didn't see much movement from heat shrinking, maybe I should have had the iron hotter. At this point I only have one coat on the bottom and sides and can't decide how to proceed. Besides aesthetics and performance in the water, are there other issue with this wavy fabric? Will the boat be useible, sound? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Conway Posted October 27, 2020 Report Share Posted October 27, 2020 On 10/22/2020 at 11:39 AM, Timothy Conway said: At this point I only have one coat on the bottom and sides and can't decide how to proceed. Having decided to move forward, I painted the top of the kayak with exterior stain blocking primer. I thinned the primer down much more than I felt I should have and it still seemed to cover good. after 24 hours the polyester was still as tight as when I started. I then put a coat of Rustoleum overtop of that. Once dried it looks good, no sags just as tight as when I started. My feeling is the 9 oz polyester did not like the Rustoleum or I should have thinned the Rustoleum down much more than I did. This of course is just my observation and most likely incorrect. This is my first time building a KOF craft or painting fabric. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hirilonde Posted October 28, 2020 Report Share Posted October 28, 2020 If by exterior stain blocking primer you mean oil based primer, then I don't get it. That primer and Rustoleum aren't that different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Conway Posted October 29, 2020 Report Share Posted October 29, 2020 Yes exterior oil based stain blocking primer and I can't say that I can understand it either. I plan to start a ought kayak this winter and I'll use primer on that one. If the fabric loosens on the new boat, then I can blame me, not sewing it tight enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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