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ChrisR

Core Sound 17 Questions

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Hi everyone! I bought a used CS17 earlier this summer, and have been having a great time sailing and getting to know it. I'm relatively new to sailing and previously only have experience with a Hobie Adventure Island, so please excuse me if I ask obvious questions. I have quite a few questions, but will start with the two that have been bugging me the most so far.

 

1. I don't really have anything to compare them against, but the masts that came with the boat feel like they are too heavy. In addition to being difficult to step, they make the boat feel "tippy" especially at rest.  The main weighs 31.2 lbs. and the mizzen weighs 31.6 lbs (rigged with sail track, cleats halyard, etc). They are both one piece aluminum poles and taper on the top third. I think they may have been intended to be flagpoles. Are these masts too heavy? What do the masts from the mast kit weigh? It seems like most people use aluminum masts. Are there other options, or is there a reason for the popularity of aluminum?

 

2. The rudder has a downhaul line, but no up haul. Is rigging one as simple as drilling a hole in the rudder blade and running it up along the top of the tiller, or is there a more appropriate way to rig one?

 

Thanks for your help! As I mentioned, I am learning and would love any pointers or suggestions that you may have for learning how to best use this fun little boat. I'm in Tampa, FL. If there is anyone nearby that would like to let me bug them with a million questions for a couple of hours, I would love to meet up. 

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The flag poles do seem heavy. I'm sure that one of the good folks at B and B can tell you exactly what the specified mast sections weigh. I've attached some pictures of the rudder uphaul on Summer Breeze, a CS-17, Mk-3. The uphaul goes to a clam cleat on the side of the tiller. The hook hanging on a wire is a safety hook that is used to keep the rudder blade from dropping while trailering.DSCN1989.thumb.JPG.83a28c6f64070fd285617a65b25d54a3.JPGDSCN1990.thumb.JPG.c8eef4171fbea4b401093cbf36739e54.JPGDSCN1991.thumb.JPG.8dff99d5cfb43b23bbcec65e1478f55d.JPG

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I made an aluminum/birdsmouth composite in two pieces, instead of the two aluminum sections and a wooden upper the plans show. The main was less than 20 pounds. Flag poles make lousy masts, though look good. The aluminum is usually 6063, which is literally half the strength of 6061 spec'd in the plans and generally not a good choice on a small boat, like a Core Sound.

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I took my 17 to the canvas shop yesterday for a cover.  I will be glad to weigh the masts when it comes back thurs or Friday.  I made them with the aluminum tubes per graham's plans.

 

On the uphaul, see foto for what I did.  Similar to Chick's, not as elegant.  It's just a line from the trailing edge of the rudder to a cleat on top of the rudder stock.  Needed for shallow water, storage, stopping flopping, etc.

 

xRND0n7BBMNchcsUJWAJnybUoGzB0oD0M4FrgJHy7gfiFwzIjJfLQ531Y0a3hHAY0s4LQjo2EEcmBtB-G-nSDs2yWFBxsb3NiP-g2dayiEVxHanHT1eqH3oFb8YFgklsql0mfkCewTd7HirSnhU4Cc5KfQJEJiRKHV7ZTztDZpMTa2-JIWcwhQVuICu6a68BjNGvjF_25iNcPMimUlA9U_h1Rb87_-O12In9NCDaqZkq7fRuKQHPA96t-Wu_zC4EFzvA_FLq5IOEPkkYNKf4vrUvbHvEPB4HcSrY2flmLNaH3GKgPh8Ae4NZk_NI8BPh934SDxQvl1Me7v6atpAGAtVJvztOn0KVIq4Fc3dCaV8Hy0XKOidVNNsqJGqQl9pTeDlacyw7VhyE4qE8NokhaavWJvxDG3x7AT_84mecV0O61jIe9c4nI-v17yJXSiJwywu6RcEQWXfGvNw1FS6gSDXwo41DcuLvphjnU9MJ_bXPIyfonn8hy4AahniVDCusOFxNWEbm_OBkqjo6ZuXuDSjAw0tGNyl9QrybfSf6px8nX8rFX4RBmtgvosVdZSm5-uUOToH7f-6S4zBUAoxGkIxYbaLafnBBL-Cd_xxQ3w=w348-h618-no

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Yeah, those flagpoles are going to weight a lot more than Graham's specified construction.  Like 50% more.  And may not be any stronger, and you are not wrong about them making you tippy.  Weight up high, on the mast, is nearly always considered undesirable.

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I forgot about your mast question.  I built mine of aluminum according to the specs on the plans supplied by Graham.  They are easily handled by this almost 61 year old guy.  The balance point is right at the lower section joint.  I was thinking that putting a little lead weight in the heels would make it even easier, but would add difficulty to de-rigging.  I have never used the third mast hole, as I have two reef points.  slab reefing will be the next project.  

 

Happy sailing,

David Jost

Massachusetts

 

 

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I buried the uphaul lanyard inside the rudderhead on the CS-17. It attached the same way, a knot, glued into a hole in the blade, it's just the line ran up a capped gap, along the aft outboard edge of the rudder head. The downhaul did the same thing, except was at the inboard (leading edge) side of the rudderhead.

 

The mast was a section of aluminum tubing, I forget the length, but around 12', with the rest birdsmouth. The halyard was internal with a standard sheave box at the masthead and a stainless exit about a foot above the partners.

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Thanks for your replies! The uphill should be easy enough to rig. Your pictures were very helpful. I'll have to do a little bit more research into options for the mast, but suspect that ordering a kit from B&B will be the most convenient way of solving this problem. My current masts are heavy enough that they prevent me from sailing alone, so it is a problem that I would like to solve sooner than later. I imagine that I'll also have to make adjustments to the mast steps as the current masts have 2.75" OD bases, and I believe the mast kit is sold with a 2.5" OD base. One problem at a time...

 

I have another question around reefing. I think that I understand how everything needs to be rigged, but am a little bit unclear on the downhaul adjustments. Do I need to re-hook the sail downhaul to the new lowest grommet of the sail when reefed, or is there a way to rig a line that will accomplish the same thing without having to go to the main mast to manually move the hook? I'm referring to the reefing setup shown here.

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The flagpoles make terrible masts. As has been pointed out, they use a softer grade of aluminum to allow them to be able to spin taper the pole. They have to use the same heavy wall thickness all the way to the top. In fact the act of spin tapering actually forces the wall thickness to increase which is why the center of gravity is so high on flag pole masts.

 

We are able to calculate the loads on the mast at different heights and reduce the diameter and wall thickness as required.  

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On reefing, you either move the downhaul up to the new grommet or add a second line and hook and leave that placed in the reef grommet so that all you need to do is haul it down when you ease the halyard.  The second is far preferable for the main mast.  I need to add that to mine.

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I would love to see photos of slab reefing rigging.  I currently lower the sail a little, haul on the new downhaul (put on prior to leaving the dock, then move the sprit to the next loop up.  This works fine on the mizzen, but when single handling, it makes for quite a show with the main.  

 

It would be so nice to lower the main, haul on the outhaul, downhaul, re-raise.  No messing with the sprit.  

 

 

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I used a section of PEX tubing, which I embedded into my rudder.  It makes a slick passageway for my uphaul.  This would be difficult to retrofit, but it can be done.  

IMG_0296.JPG

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