Andy B

Hello everyone, I'm reviving this old thread because it's a good question--where are the tell tales on a cat-ketch best placed? There's good information out there about where to locate them on a standard sloop (headsail and main sail), but does that translate the same to a cat-ketch?

Looks like you used the original wood? And what filler did you use? FWIW, I love the look of this--just enough aging to give it some character!

I think we may have SEVEN B&B boats coming!!!!!! Me (Andy) CS-20 mk1 Alan CS-20 mk3? Alan's parents CS-20 mk3 Steve CS 20 mk3 Ted CS 17 mk3 Erik Princess 22 Niels CS 20 mk3 And Don is coming, on foot, though if you know Don any one of us will be glad to have him as crew. He's knowledgeable, kind, has good food, and most days smells alright If you are on the fence, join us!

I am signed up for the event and looking forward to it. I have a cabin (on land) that sleeps four. At the Muskegon Messabout I coordinate, I met Eric and some others who attended Raid Erie. It sounds like a great event! Alan is correct, the campsite reservation page says sold out, but that's not true. Check the Raid Erie Website and FB page for more information. My plans are still loose because I don't know how many of the family are coming. I might have room in my cabin, but likely not. They do allow you to combine boats in the slips, as long as the total length of the boats does not exceed the slip length. Unfortunately I tried to save a few bucks and got a 36' slip. That means a CS-17 couldn't snug up next to my CS-20. Bummer. But, there might be others with 17 feet of room in their slip, ask around on the Facebook page. Alan, great to see you and family are coming! I'm looking forward to meeting you. I plan to sail over to the island, though I will make ferry reservations just in case the weather window doesn't cooperate.

I have been amazed how little Alan and his Dad have touched the tiller. That wind vane sure works!

The live stream is awesome, Alan! We still have snow here so I can live vicariously through your stream! I'm not sure if it will inspire me or distract me from working on my mast float!

@JeffM, I like it! I have CS-20 number 36 (bought a few years ago). I will probably go the route of a fabric tent, but a place that's always dry is tempting.

Jeff, are you able to share any pictures of your "high trunk cabin"? I'd love to see them.

I have a CS-20 and the Honda 2.3; not because I chose it, but because it came with my other boat. I believe it is the long shaft model; that is important because even then it doesn't stick far into the water (I don't have a transom cut-out). The 2.3 is enough to push the boat. I don't have currents or tides in my area, but I have had it push the boat with a number of passengers. A neutral would be nice, but I have the "aft cockpit" version of the boat, so the tiller is right there, and most times it's easy to swing the motor around. The light weight of the 2.3 is nice. It also runs forever on a liter of gas (that's about what the tank holds). It is noisy for its size. I think others like the Suzuki for the neutral and it is quieter. PS--you might want to post this in the B&B section of the forum, more traffic there.

Thanks, guys. Like Reacher I'm mainly thinking about this because it's cold here and my mind turns to summer boating when I'm not downhill skiing! My set up is more what Reacher described--there's about 3 inches of wood coming out each end of the mast, and that wood extends into the mast at least six inches, I believe. I did not know what a slide hammer is--thanks! Regarding the swelling--I was initially concerned about it being treated wood and thus leading to a mast failure (I know there's at least one story of that on this forum). But I don't believe it's treated wood. The swelling is on the part of the wood that protrudes out from the mast. I see it mainly on the bottom of the aft/mizzen mast, as it's a tight squeeze into the hole/step in the thwart and then into the holder. The other issue, much more minor, is that it is cracking just a bit and I worry about the strength of the hardware screwed into it (halyard block). As I type this, I realize that the wood on my boat underwent a significant change in humidity, moving from dry Denver to the the variable moisture of the upper midwest. That doesn't matter much for the epoxied plywood, but exposed timber like the mast plug would change. That would explain why in the first year I had to file the plug down a bit to get it to fit, but it wasn't an issue this year. Sorry for the rambling, but talking out loud is valuable, even on a forum. I think my plan will be to watch it more this coming season, and if cracks continue, I can gouge out as much as possible and insert the plastic plug like Reacher mentioned.

My older boat has wooden mast plugs. The plugs swell from time to time, making them a tight fit to step. Conversely, they are showing some checking/splitting on the exposed wood. Ideally I'd like to replace them with the starboard plastic plugs that B&B sells. My problem is how to remove the wooden plugs. It's obviously an all-or-nothing job--I can't get tart hacking away at the wooden plugs and then quit if I can't get them out. Based on some holes I drilled I would estimate the plug goes at least six inches into the mast (I didn't build the boat so I don't know for sure). That's a lot of tight wood to remove! Any suggestions?

For those in the Midwest and Great Lakes area. We've had two successful Messabouts in Muskegon in fall 2024 and fall 2025. This past fall we had four Core Sound boats (mine, Paul, Red, Don). It was great! I'd like to see small boat sailing grow in Michigan. I've put together a website, a facebook page and we have an instagram account. Check them out if you'd like to join us! We are planning summer events soon. www.michiganmessabouts.com Facebook Group Instagram Here's a picture from our last event to get you excited.

@Reacher Good question, I'd love to hear more from others about that, too. The only thing I've tried is to raise a partial mizzen. Either reef the mizzen (normally or loosely). Or just don't raise the mizzen all the way, then go raise the main, then come back and raise the mizzen. It's not a great solution but it has worked for me.

Thanks, Alan, for the super detailed explanation. I've only done the process under your "Raising the rudder?" section, because I'm usually not going anywhere so I don't care about losing ground. Now I have something to practice next year! And it reminds me I need a tiller tamer [edit Tiller Clutch} --do you guys have any available right now?

Here's a lot of discussion on the topic.