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Core Sound 20 Mk 3 -- #4 "Chessie" . .


Pete McCrary

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Thanks all -- for the suggestions.  All worthy of use or consideration.

 

Calculating the advantage of lead weights in the mast below its pivot indicate: 1) With a specific gravity of 11x that of water, the maximum weight that could be in that volume (4.1 pints) is 45 lbs of lead.  With a leaver arm of 10" the weight advantage at 44" above the pivot is only ~10 lbs -- reducing the lift required down to 39 lbs.. That helps, but maybe not enough and at a cost of 45 lbs at deck level and far forward.

 

The mast sans-lines, weighed in at 22 lbs.. For me that's easily lifted by one hand at the C.g.  And even the lifting force needed while standing in the forward hatch is not too much if I can lift it from shoulder height wuing both arms.  The problem is that the [present] starting position (of the mast) is closer to waist level -- using my left arm -- with little help from the right.  Last night I dreamed of a solution.

 

Presently I must use the mizzen's topping lift (looped around the mainmast) to raise it high enough to open the forward hatch -- then, after opening the hatch, lowering [the mast] so that it lies on a cushion placed over the garage.  Then remove the topping lift loop, go thru the cabin to the forward hatch, and finally raising the mast.  The mast is held upright with its own topping lift reeved thru the anchor roller and belayed to an anchor cleat.  Finally, duck below securing the mast bolt with its locking nut.  Works pretty good EXCEPT the lifting force strains my strength limit.

 

The new proposed procedure is only slightly changed.  Instead of looping the mizzen's topping lift around the mast -- I'll use a "Fall-Away Open Hook.  By doing that I can leave the mast at about a 26 degree angle where I can get a much better angle at shoulder height using both arms -- with a further advantage that the required force is reduced ~ 12% (~ 6 lbs).  The hook will just fall away as I raise the mast.

 

The last few inches when lowering the mast has also been a problem.  Lots of force at the very end and the need to reposition my hands as the mast is lowered below shoulder level.  My fix for that is a folding "A" frame set on the garage.  (1/24/2018 edit: The "A" frame has been substitute with a folding stool with two throw cushions placed on its top).  Lowering the mast to that position (while standing in the forward hatch), then coming out of the cabin to set the hook holding the mast at ~ 19 degrees.  Then remove the "A" frame and lower the mast with the mizzen topping lift.

 

With the fall-away open hook and A-frame, I feel pretty sure that raising and lowering the mainmast will no longer be a stressful undertaking.  Below is a sketch on what I have in mind.  Please offer critical comments regarding the design and proposed procedure.

 

image.thumb.jpeg.4e62adc1de9ba0e521f006ef2f434fa7.jpeg

 

I will line the inside-bottom of the hook with electrical tape to add friction.  The topping lift line (just a single loop) doesn't slip.  The hook with black tape shouldn't either.

 

Thanks, Paul, for the starting tips for the OBM.  And next time I'll remember to take along my GPS.  I, also, have a rolling cylinder (~2" diameter) welded on to the bottom of the aft cross-bar.  I've needed one on every trailer that I've owned.  This one has a grease nipple.

 

Ken, thanks for all the tips.  I'll make a list and add to it as I recognize problems.  With my CLC PocketShip "Tattoo" I originally had long prep and takedown times.  After some experience, I reduced the time by more than half.  With experience, I'm sure I can do that with "Chessie."  BTY, I've learned that casual help (at the ramp) is distracting.  I try to limit it to a minimum -- like holding the docking lines when launching and recovering.

 

 

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Short addition re "sausage bags:"  I rolled up both sails, put one bag over one end of both sails and the other bag over the other end of both sails.  Quasi-sausage.  As someone said, saves putting in the battens, which was a very fussy and time consuming job, and the sails are ready to be put right on to the sail tracks with a simple unroll.

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   Here's a sketch of the way I was picturing it.  The process will be quicker if you find a way to release the mast from the crutch without climbing onto the boat.  You might use a boat hook to release a loop of bungee cord or you could come up with a tricky knot that can be released by pulling on a release line, etc.  Then the process would be:

1. Carry snacks from the truck to the cockpit.  While you're next to the cockpit, release the mast from the crutch.

2. Walk back to the truck to get the sail bags and on the way stop and pull on the mast raising line to bring the mast vertical.  Cleat the raising line off to secure the mast temporarily.

3. Bring the sails to the cockpit and take the rudder cover off.

4. Climb aboard and take the main sail to the forward hatch.

5. Secure the base of the main mast and untie the raising line.

6. Set up the mainsail.

7. go back and rig the mizzen mast and sail.

8. etc.

   As you rig the boat more often you'll find a good sequence so you'll be making as few trips from the boat to the truck as possible and you'll always be getting ready for the next task while you're doing the task at hand.

 

   I was eventually able to rig my CS17 (Mark I) in 11 minutes without rushing as long as I didn't have anyone helping.

mast raising.jpg

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The perpendicular lifting force 44" aft of the tabernacle required to start the mast rotation is ~ 53 lbs.. For the height shown in the sketch the tension (for the lifting pulleys) looks to be about x4 of that, or 212 lbs, maybe more.  That's a lot of pressure on the tabernacle in the wrong place and direction.  A "gin poll" or "A-frame" could gain you a better angle for the lifting line with less horizontal pressure on the tabernacle.

 

For my 17' Whitholz catboat I had to step a 26' mast that weighed 65 lbs thru a hole in the deck.  I managed it with a 3-piece, wooden crane that used the trailer crank for power.  It worked ok, but stepping the mast was still a "bear."  

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I also had a 17' Whitholz catboat with a Marconi rig. I converted the thru-deck mast to a tabernacle and used an extension on the winch stand kinda like Ken's sketch. My extension was longer, and used the trailer winch to pull the mast up. To convert to a tabernacle, I cut the mast above deck level and added plates on either side for the mast to pivot on. My mast had stays.

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Yet another thing to try (i've never tried it) connect the main sprit to the mast via the snotter first.  Let the snotter all the way out. "step" the clew end of the sprit down into the cabin so it is pointing up to the sky. Then haul in on the snotter line to raise the mast until the snotter is pretty much all the way in. Then finish raising the mast by holding onto the sprit and pushing the mast up until vertical. Then maybe you can "re step" the clew end of the sprit somwhere that it will stay put while you go below to secure the tabernacle bolt. 

 

Based on the quick modeling below, the snotter will either need to be made extra long or perhaps an extension used. 

 

 

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That's a great idea!  I'll try it in the driveway (tomorrow or Monday) before fabricating the fall-away open hook.  And you don't need to "re-step" the clue [end of the sprit] -- just keep pressure on the sprit with one hand, and with the other, pull taught and belay the topping lift [line] to a cleat on the side of companionway's slide. Of course, you would have already reeved the main's topping lift thru the anchor roller.  The initial thrust on the sprit can be reduced by manually lifting the mainmast to shoulder level.  For fun, I might calculate the thrust needed at that point.  I suppose it will work in reverse as well.  We'll see tomorrow.  I'd do it today, but for the weather.

 

Another advantage [of this procedure] is that the forward hatch may not have to be used at all -- and the mizzen wouldn't be needed to raise the mainmast part way [to open the forward hatch].  

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I sure like my sliding forward hatch. I can open it with the masts down, stand and lift the main, or lift it part way and then sit on the cabin top with my feet below to lift it. My hold down nut is in the anchor well, so I just lean forward and reach down into the well to put it on while holding the mast in position with my other hand. The mizzen is also on a tabernacle so it's REALLY easy.

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I tried Alan's idea of using the sprit and the snotter tackle on the mainmast with Henry watching and ready to call 911.  Several observations:

a. The main sprit is too long, the mizzen, just about right.

b. A dedicated pole is probably better because there needs to be a cleat to belay the snot ter line to free up hands for repositioning.  Also, the sprit reefing hardware gets in the way.

c. The forces are quite reasonable.

d. Lowering is much harder to control.

e. The snotter and topping loft lines need to be longer.

 

All things considered, I'm sticking with my open-hook (for raising) and folding A-frame (for lowering).

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This is the arrangement I used on the ketch, before removing the cabin.

 

The small, one speed trailer winch was mounted on the bulkhead, just aft of the partner beams. The tabernacle didn't go all the way through the deck, just stood on top. Some flexing was seen, but not to worry about. The new arrangement has the  winch in the same location, except the tabernacle goes all the way down to the keel batten now, so it's much stronger.BYYB-400.thumb.jpg.5f0a94ff31145d71875afb2e1b56a5c0.jpg

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I spent a little time in the basement sorting through this dilemma this weekend. I'm not getting any stronger as I age, so it's worth thinking about now. I till manhandle my masts on my Sea Pearl and have even done it underway, but it sure was easier 10 years ago. 

 

I used the line drawing and standing in various locations to try and work through some stuff. Since the goal is to not stand on the cabin top to erect or bring down the mast, the options are tough. I imagine the elusive trench hatch would have made this point mute, but I spent two years thinking about that and don't think there is a solution for that style hatch that doesn't have compromises.

 

So that said, I ultimately think that simplicity after safety make this a problem. I like Ken's design, because if that tabernacle can't hold 200+ pounds of force, something is wrong. The way it's designed, I just can't see it being a problem.  It's safe on the way up and down as it's always under tension. At best it may need a couple of side stays to keep the mast centered. And making the extension a bit higher makes the loads less.

 

The downside is taking the mast down while underway and for me that is desirable. There are lots of grade A skinny sailing water accessible only be getting under a bridge where I live. Anytime you have to store gear like an A-frame aboard and take time to rig, it just creates complexity. For me complexity subtracts from enjoyment.

 

I think PARS idea makes a lot of sense and would be the safest, but you would have to put a slot on the anchor well bulkhead and then figure out a way to seal it when underway. I would foresee the winch as a removable affair that could be stowed in the forward deep locker but braced against the bulkhead behind the tabernacle in use. 

 

I hadn't thought much about Chick's forward sliding hatch but I can see the wisdom now of it in being able to just push the mast up with your legs from a step stool.  But how would this work coming down?

 

It will be fun to see what the final outcome that works best is. As disappointed as I am to not be as far along as I want to be, there are some good things about following the trailblazers.

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The fall-away open hook works just fine for raising and lowering the mainmast.  However, for lowering the mast I also need a folding stool and two throw cushions.  The stool I always have in the pickup, and the cushions are always in the boat.  The physical effort and stress is greatly reduced and I feel fully in control at all times.  Here's an outline of the procedure:

 

a. Remove mizzenmast from its transport crutch.

b. Lower mainmast (from its transport crutch) onto a pair of throw cushions set on top of garage and remove transport crutch from mizzen step and stow it.

c. Step the mizzenmast.

d. Snap on the business end of the mizzen topping lift to the open hook and belay the bitter end.

e. Using the mizzen topping lift & the open hook -- raise the mainmast high enough (~ 8' to 10' along side the mizzen) so that the forward hatch may be fully opened -- then belay the topping lift line.

f. Open the forward hatch and standing [in the hatch], belay the business end of the main topping lift to an anchor cleat -- then reeve the bitter end thru the anchor roller (towards the stern) and loosely loop it around a cleat easily reached from that position.

g. Now (with the mainmast almost at shoulder level), rotate the mast all-the-way up and hold it there with one hand and (with the other hand) pull tight the topping lift line and belay it.  The open hook will have dropped off the mainmast as it was rotated full up.

h,. Duck below and secure the mast bolt with its locking nut.

i. Recover and stow the open hook and throw cushions.

FINI.

 

The reverse is slightly different.  In abbreviated form:

 

a. A folding stool and two throw cushions are placed on top (i.e., the underside) of the forward hatch cover (which is laying upside-down on the garage).

b. The mainmast is secured with the topping lift while [below] the locking nut is removed from its bolt.

c. Holding the mast upright with one hand -- release the topping lift and then (with both hands) rotate the mast down onto the throw cushions and folding stool.

d. Exit the cabin and (by using the mizzen tipping lift and the open hook) raise the mast alongside the mizzenmast high enough so that the folding stool and throw cushions may be removed and the forward hatch closed.

e. Replace the throw cushions on the garage -- and then, using the mizzen topping lift and open hook, rotate the mainmast down onto the cushions, etc.,etc,...

FINI

 

Here are a few photos:

image.thumb.jpeg.5866a27d74756280ecd251b80745f4d9.jpegimage.thumb.jpeg.c8a398d1aaec3f685449fe8db6487ba5.jpeg

 

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Hook still holding up mast.  I'm in good starting position for raising mast (standing and using both arms -- much easier than starting at waist level.

 

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Notice that the hook is falling away.

 

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Nearly there!

 

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FINI.

 

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Above the mast has been rotated down to the stool and cushions.  I've also exited the cabin and engaged the open hook on the mainmast so that it may be raised enough to close the forward hatch.

 

The process has many steps, but [for me] none are beyond my diminishing strength limits -- and I don't feel any instability.  Help is not wanted as it's distracting during a process with many steps.  The only "help" I would want is someone watching and willing to call 911 if I get myself into a dangerous situation -- like falling off the boat or forgetting to secure the mast before placing the locking nut on the mast bolt.  If crew is available to help, I would want them to have a "check-list" and warn me if I'm about to take a miss-step.  At this point I feel much better and safer about the whole "mast-raising" situation.

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I, too, had the same concern.  I was considering a folding A-frame -- another gadget and complication.  I thought of the folding stool and throw cushions in the middle of the night !!   Actually, I had a very hard time raising the mainmast, and it worried me quit a lot.  I feel great relief that this proved out to be a pretty good solution with a minimum of gadgetry.  Thanks for your comment.

 

Tomorrow is "Chessie's" official Maiden Voyage.  Three neighbor-helpers will be on board.  We'll try to get some good pictures.

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"Chessie's" official Maiden Voyage was on Tuesday, August 1.  Helping-neighbors, Branda and Janet, were honored guests.  The weather was clear, near calm, and warm (~ 90).  The sails were up to catch occasional light puffs of wind -- which moved us quite well.  The motor  and ballast tank were well tested and performed satisfactorily.  We enjoyed our time on the water having lunch.  The ladies broke out a hidden half-bottle of champagne and made toasts to "Chessie" and her builder.  As the "designated" skipper I was only allowed a sip of what was left in the bottle.

 

Setup time improved from 1 hr 30 min to 1 hr 15 min.  But that included 3 mistakes that had to be undone and redone.  That would take about 20 min off.  And when I improve the sequencing, I'm pretty sure I can get it down to about 3/4 hr.  After inspection on shore, I can report that there were no leaks.  Here are a few photos:

 

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Here she's "road-ready" with sails (battens in place) inside the cabin.

 

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The main & mizzenmasts were removed from the transport crutch and lowered onto the throw cushions.  With the transport crutch removed -- I'm preparing to step the mizzenmast.

 

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Now the mizzenmast is stepped and can be used to rotate the mainmast high enough to open the forward hatch.

 

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Rotating the mainmast high enough to open forward hatch (using the mizzenmast and open hook) -- then moving to the forward hatch to rotated mast to full-up (with much better leverage).

 

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Here I'm preparing to use the main topping lift to secure the mast after it is rotated full-up.  Next I'll rotate the mast from shoulder height.

 

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Here I'm below to attach the nut to the mast's bolt poking thru Blk 1.  Notice that the topping lift (reeved thru the anchor roller) is taut.

 

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Lowering the rudder.

 

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Brenda at the helm while I'm raising the mainsail.

 

There is much to learn in order to be really proficient in getting it all together for lots of fun sailing.  Next time I'll hope for a little more wind.  It's been a long 27 months.  I was like a kid who's "eyes are bigger than his stomach": because I was retired, I thought I could do it all in just 6 months.  The effort has been rewarding -- and I'll probably build a 10th boat this winter (tender for "Chessie").

 

 

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