11 replies to this topic

[Howard]

Anybody know what becomes of all those storm ravaged boats following disasters like Sandy?

 

I would suspect many of these boats are total losses, yet many would also have salvageable items like masts, sails, some electronics, engines, and all manner of hardware like anchors, rodes, cleats, etc. On some sailboats, there might be a ton or so of lead hanging on the bottom.

 

Where does all that stuff go? Hopefully not all of it to a landfill.

[Hirilonde]

I think a lot of why so much is wasted is timing, room, time and cost.  Yeah, it is a shame to see so much go to waste.  But most of it has such a small monetary value compared to the cost to salvage, store, market and then still only hope to sell that unless you want it now and can get in touch with the owner it will end up as junk.   Hmmm, we have junk yards for cars and airplanes, maybe boats?  

 

It would be great if there were a good way to see the usable stuff end up some where it would be used.  I just don't see it happening for most of the stuff.  The few used marine consignment stores like in Wickford, RI, Mystic CT, Fall River, MA and Oriental NC are few and far between and limited in what they recycle.*  Just another loss due to our bigger, better, faster, more of it wasteful society.

 

*The strore in Oriental is owned by the former owners of the Wickford..  They sold Wickford  to go cruising, ended up in Oriental in need of an income and started over again. Mystic was bought by Wickford's new owners and  Fall River is a  relatively new addition.

 

http://orientalmarineconsignment.com/    http://marineconsignment.com/

[PAR]

Most boats that are repairable and insured get repaired and put back in service. This accounts for a large percentage, though can take some time. Naturally, the insured boats that are totaled, have a few things that happen, which usually means anything that salvageable, but cost effective to do so, is pulled and the hulk ground up at the local landfill, for incinerator fuel. The abandoned boats take a long time to dispose of. This usually falls on the state and the first to be addressed, are the ones that are causing a problem, such as being on someone's property, obstructing utility companies or state lands or infrastructure and of course, are a hazard in some fashion. Last on the list, are the ones that aren't causing any harm, just sunk along a shore or in a marsh, etc. These can stay this way for years, particularly with current state budgets being stretched, extra funds to remove these eye sores is well down on their priority list.

 

As far as picking up one of the derelicts, I wouldn't bother. If it was worth salvage, it would see it, so you're looking at a wreck or a boat that's been stripped of all it's worthwhile pieces. Next comes the trouble of finding and contacting the current owner, satisfying any liens or fines and the headaches that come with that. Lastly, thinking you've found your free world cruiser, is usually just a pipe dream. Cost up putting a new rig, sails, engine and electronics on a 40' yacht and you'll come back down to earth pretty quickly.

 

Yes, there are bone yards for boats too. I have one not far from me I frequent a few times a year for that odd part, no one else seems to have. When you walk around in one of these places, you just find yourself saying, "damn, what a shame", because there's lots of nice pedigree designs, but they've met an early end, for whatever reason. Every time I go I see this beautify Swan 44, well okay, one side is beautify, the other has had about 50% of it torn off in a collision.

[Howard]

I was thinking less of finding a "find" than pure salvage of the wrecks that won't be repaired. We have all seen those photos of a jumbled mass of boats that were torn from their moorings or floated off the docks and rode the storm surge inland until the drifted into something solid enough to stop them. The assumption is they are total losses. Sounds like that is not the case?

 

I know a lot of the high value boats with light damage that are not repaired by the owner end up in places like this:

 

http://www.yachtsalvage.com/

 

Or maybe these are not so valuable boats (condition and extent of damage being a factor)?

 

But really, my thought was along the line of the chop shop / stripper operation where things of value are stripped off and the carcass ground up and disposed of. Seems there would be opportunity for this after these major storm events. Temporary opportunity. Move in with a large crew, grab what you can and chop it up......the sum of the dismantled parts being much greater than the whole?

 

But speaking of this, what is the ownership status of boats that float off? On the water, I seem to recall any salvor has a claim on any lose boats found floating around. Does ownership stay intact with no rights to the salvor of boats that end up on dry land?

[Howard]

BTW, on the finding finds for the classic plastic boats, if I was of the mindset, I'd spend time walking the docks in areas where such boats would be found and look for one that gave the appearance of not having left the dock in some time. Dock lines and sail covers with moss on them are a good indication as are no sails at all. I'd ask the marina operator for a name and address and find out whats what. Likely as not, I'd find an owner who had either lost interest, had failing health or had passed and a seriously disinterested spouse would like to be rid of it. Of course I'd want to make sure it had not deteriorated to derelict status and was still sound, just not being maintained.

 

Boats on the Great Lakes are harder to find, but have only known fresh water and then only a few months a year.

[PAR]

It's not as easy as you might think. All the boats belong to someone and declaring "salvage" comes with some risks and responsibility. There are deals to be made, but it takes quite a bit of leg work, as well as jumping through several legal hoops.

 

The insurance companies get first dibs, then come the folks that have incurred costs, such as marinas with unpaid service, slip fees, recovery and rescue operations. Next up are the private salvage claims, which can get tedious with the paper work. Lastly if derelicts are to be broken up, someone still owns them and they get the proceeds from the break up, after costs (paying someone to break her up for it's equipment). In many cases, the equipment isn't worth the labor to remove, so the whole lot is set to the land fill. In fact, it usually costs them to drag it there. It's a cost versus reward thing and the margins are slim at best.

 

Lets look at a common 25' sailor. It was sunk or shoved up onto shore during the storm. It's rig is toast, the engine full of water and worthless, ditto the transmission, electronics and much of the electrical system. You can recover ground tackle (what's a used 25 pound anchor worth?), maybe the sails, if below and bagged and can be cleaned, these could be sold. Taking controls out of them usually isn't worth the trouble, as most are application specific. None of the soft stuff, like cushions, curtains and other items will be worth salvaging, so you're left with a hull shell, liner and deck cap, much of which may also need repair.

 

Simply put, out of 100 potential prospects, you might find one or two that have hope, at least in regard to equipment, if not restoration. This is a pretty discouraging premise, if you're doing the leg work, walking through yard after yard, looking for a deal. This is one reason insurance companies and owners walk away fairly easily. They look at the costs associated with repairs and it's a simple business decision. If you're lucky, you can recover a very meager portion of the yacht's value with hardware sales.

 

I've had some luck with this, but I've also taken a number of "baths". It takes a good bit of experience to know which yacht is worth taking these types of risks on. In some cases you can walk into a marina and get an opportunity to strip a Catalina 25 (for example), for a small fee. It relieves them of the bother and they get to make something. You can also make an offer on the whole boat, which is waht they want, so you don't make a mess or get hurt in their yard, "doing the deed". In the end, the only effective way, is to do the leg work and make friends with these folks. They want to free up the "dead spots" in their yard for paying customers, so you're doing them a favor, but they have to be cautious too.

[Howard]

To those who frequent the B&B forum, you may have noticed that I am assembling the components to build a Princess 26. Aside from the labor to build it, the structural components consisting of plywood, lumber and epoxy amount to less than15% to  20% of my total estimated cost to build. The rest, consisting of hardware etc. to fit her out, if purchased new, is going to be a big number.

 

While perusing my March/April 2013 edition of "Good Old Boat", on page 52 is found an article where the author recounts how she has spent the past year or two working to find homes for derelict / abandoned boats that have accumulated in the yard where she and her husband are working on their own boat. Some are nice; some were nice but damaged, some are true derelicts. The boats she was working with were free for the taking.

 

It now occurs to me that I might be able to find one and simply strip it myself.  They may have everything from the Bomar hatches I'm looking for, windows, cleats, anchors, anchor rollers, blocks, swim ladders, navigation lights, interior lights and hardware.......perhaps even the lead for my keel, outboard motor and who knows, maybe even a trailer? I know there is a world of equipment and hardware on my 1978 Montgomery, that if stripped off, would work just fine on a new boat.

 

The only issue would be the necessity of cutting up the carcass when I'm finished stripping it. What I don't use, I may be able to sell or trade to someone who can do it for me.

 

Am I nuts?

[Hirilonde]

I will stay away from the "Am I nuts?" question 

 

If you go into this assuming you will have to dispose of the hull and it makes sense, then go for it.  There are so many fixer uppers on the market with all their hardware, there is no market for it when you are done.

[Howard]

Assumption is the boat will be a true salvage to be stripped of useable hardware and the remnant hull disposed of. When you think of it, there may be much more than simply hardware and fittings. Some of them will have perfectly good teak and mahogany trim pieces down below.....with all the related hinges and hardware. Things I won't have to buy or build.

 

If you had to buy a derelict to strip, that would be one thing.......but if the derelict was free?

 

Have cordless drill and wrenches........will travel!

[Hirilonde]

Even if the boat is listed as "for sale" on Craig's List or such, very often the owner will realize they have to get rid of it before it costs them more not to.  Don't be afraid to offer to "relieve them of their liability".  Keep in mind that you will likely have to move the boat before beginning your salvage, and a displacement hull does not get moved for free.  Also make sure that they  are not removing stuff before you get it.  Big ticket items like winches have a habit of disappearing before you get it unless it is specified that they are part of the deal.  Simply inheriting someone elses liability without the big parts isn't worth it. 

[Howard]

I think this would have to be treated as an on the spot decision......no chance for others to strip it.......which leads me to wonder how many parts are simply stolen off derelicts on the yards?

 

I will be in Charleston SC in a few weeks and will have a chance to walk some docks and visit some yards to see what is out there. Related to this, I am now remembering a rough looking 27 footer parked on the side of the road near here that hasn't moved in two years. I may have a local candidate already.

[PAR]

Most boats that arrive in a bone yard get stripped of their good gear pretty quickly by the yard crew. It's cleaned up and placed on shelf with a price tag. They don't bother with the mundane stuff, but a good radio, winch or what ever will get yanked. Hinges for a locker cover will remain.