Oyster Posted February 11, 2009 Report Share Posted February 11, 2009 On another forum this was posted dealing with boating in Maine. Any clarification Summary: This bill makes it mandatory, with certain exceptions, that everyone in a watercraft wear a personal flotation device. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUKIE Posted February 12, 2009 Report Share Posted February 12, 2009 I just did a quick search on the Maine Legislative web site and didn't find anything regarding pfd use. Thank god, we still have some liberties! (Of course, I live in NH which is the only state which doesn't mandate the use of seat belts.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oyster Posted February 12, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 12, 2009 Actually there has been an update. I was hoping to get some on the ground imput since we may go up that way. http://janus.state.me.us/legis/LawMakerWeb/summary.asp?LD=164 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Lathrop Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 A couple years ago I studied the USCG statistics on drownings for several years and due to all causes. If you don't want to drown, stay out of swimming pools and away from beaches. It's safer in a boat. Applicability of such laws will be usually be at the discretion of the local officer. For instance, some years ago when my boys were teen agers, we had a picnic at a GA lake with several other families. The kids were all playing in the water. My boys were playing with our canoe, turning it over and climbing in and out. The other kids were paddling air mattresses, floating in inner tubes and playing with beach balls or just swimming. A wildlife officer came on the scene and gave my boys a citation for being in a boat without a PFD. Only $25 fine but what a stupid-stupid enforcement of a law. When the boys were younger, we were racing sailboats most weekends and they knew that if they were within 10 feet of the water, life jackets had to be on. They did this from earliest age and never gave any problem with it. Now, who gets bitten by the law? After he had delivered the citation and we were all ashore. I evaluated his IQ and judgment for him. We strongly believe in both seat belts and PFDs and are just as strongly opposed to this nanny law. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillB Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 I agree with Tom's view of PFDs and seat belts. What I don't understand is the reluctance to wear either, when they are designed to prevent injury or death. I never go out on the water without wearing a PFD or drive/ride in a vehicle without wearing the seatbelt. At the same time I don't want the government telling me I have-to wear it. Those persons that elect not to wear a PFD or use the seat belt are a statistic waiting to happen. When you remember that hypthermia can kill you in the time it takes to get back in the boat or for another boater to come to your aid, it puts a whole other light on the subject. If your paddle partner is over a couple hundred yards away when you capsize, they can not make it to you to render assistance in time before you are hypothermic. my 2 cents BillB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hirilonde Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 I think you mean hypothermia. But even so, how does a PFD help prevent or delay this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apteryx Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 PFDs are good things. I've started wearing one pretty much all the time. A radio interview with a lake cop on Lake Lewisville, Texas, a lake on which alcohol and octane are heavily consumed, convinced me. This guy had worked Lake Lewisville for 15 years or so and had never pulled a victim out wearing a PFD. I am against any law requiring adults to wear them, though, particularly a law that says anytime I'm on board a watercraft I must wear a PFD. Asleep on the hook? On the trailer at the ramp? I'm assuming I found the correct text of the law at the link earlier in this thread. It also says that watercraft carrying people to another watercraft at a mooring site don't have to wear PFDs, and campers in canoes licensed by the state and within 500 feet of shore don't have to wear them, either. Odd, ripping around an anchorage on a jetski has its hazards and canoes can be mishandled. Crazy law, written, I suspect, by a non-boater with more good intention than common sense. Uninformed lawmakers aside it's a good idea to wear a PFD when out on the water - highly recommendable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Jones Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009 Kinda sorta depends on what and where doesn't it? If I'm out in the Birder, I always have a PFD on. When Laura and I sailed our Prindle 18 or our Dolphin Srs, we always wore PFD's aboard. But we just returned from a two day sail aboard our 25 footer, during part of which we were sailing with reefed main and jib. I don't think it ever crossed either of our minds to put on a PFD during those two days. We were safely in the cockpit of the boat, two aboard, warm temps and sailing inshore waters. We just didn't see the need. Same boat, offshore, at night, you bet we have our harnesses on and are tethered to the boat. PARTICULARLY at night when one is sleeping and the other is alone on deck. As it happens, our harnesses are part of an inflatable PFD, but that's not material- offshore- the tether is far more important to me- the idea being DON'T go into the water in the first place. So I think it kinda depends on where you are and what you are doing. By the way, I detest Texas seat belt laws, although I wouldn't drive across town without one on. The motor cycle helmet laws were recently rescinded so they aren't required, which I approve up totally. Up to the rider if he wants to chance scrambling his brains. And my own brother spent 28 days in a coma, and 2 and a half months after that, in lala land from a motorcycle wreck and he had on a full face Bell. You do know that some idiot once proposed a law in Congress, to require seat belts on motorcycles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken_Potts Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009  More people die from head injuries in cars than on motorcycles. Why don't we have helmet laws for cars? Oh, that's right! Senators travel in cars and helmets are a nuisance...  PFDs and helmets and seat belts are all good equipment and as a responsible adult I feel that I should choose to use them - But I feel very strongly that the choice should be mine.  While they're forcing us to wear PFDs to protect us from ourselves shouldn't they also be forcing us to carry a PLB and file a float plan (while fishing on a pond) and wear a dry suit (in 75 degree F North Carolina water and 100 degree air) and travel in convoys (in case of u-boat attack) and if we break these laws shouldn't we be sentenced to the endangerment of the general prison population to teach us the importance of keeping ourselves safe? :  I think the exemption that Apteryx mentioned - The one allowing summer-camp teens to forgoe PFDs while less than 500 feet from shore speaks volumes. At 42 years old I'm not experienced/mature enough to sit on my boat at anchor without a PFD but a summer-camp kid gets to decide whether a PFD is prudent while he and his buddies are off on a panty raid? ;D  I hope that bill is one of those non-starters that never gets a chance. I see that it's been referred to committee by both houses - Hopefully that's just the Maine government's way of making a crazy bill go away (refer it to a special committee then never appoint the committee). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Anderson Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009 As regards hypothermia and PFD's. PFD's depending on the style have some insulative qualities. More importantly hypothermia manifests itself in a relatively short amount of time, first by clouding mental ability and second by inhibiting fine motor movement. These abilities are essential to getting yourself out of trouble or just to keep your head above water. A PFD will not cure hypothermia but wearing one may buy enough time to let you live to tell about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009 Here is a link to a site on hypothermia. I suddenly became interested in this subject after filling the cockpit of my weekender with 50 degree F water from Puget Sound last fall. It does get your attention! http://www.coldwaterbootcamp.com/pages/home.html joel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hirilonde Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009  A PFD will not cure hypothermia but wearing one may buy enough time to let you live to tell about it. Ah, now that is a good point. But if one is sailing in an open boat, with the risk of capsizing, in cold water: one really should be wearing a wet suit, or dry suit or facsimile. I know that the frost bite fleets in my area require them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbrewer Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009 I don't think anyone (here at least) would argue against the idea of wearing a PFD, or seatbelt, or motorcycle helmet if they decide that its prudent in a given situation. The problem we seem to agree on is the individual liberty to decide what that situation may be has been removed.   Our legislators at the national level have forgotten long ago the reason for their political existence, and the states (with the notable exception of Sukie's New Hampshire) have been far too willing to sell our individual liberties for federal funding and the ability to raise revenue by enforcing these laws. It will continue, of course, as long as we collectively let it.   Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LeeH Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009 and the ability to raise revenue by enforcing these laws You said a mouthful there. That's it exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Hagan Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 BoatUS usually fights these laws, but I checked their State Alerts at http://www.boatus.com/gov/state_alert.asp and Maine isn't even listed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apteryx Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 Interesting the comments about helmets, and it's amazing how the idea of helmets in cars is considered crazy. "So you think helmets in cars is crazy? Good for you - by the way, we're going to be in a head-on collision in a few minutes - care for a helmet?" On one of the sailing mailing lists I get, my love of sailing spam running deep, someone said there is a suggestion in California to require helmets on sailboats. I thought that had to be crazy, but googling around I found plenty of sailing schools that require helmets. Which, by the way, is fine by me for a private organization, but I don't think I'll sail with a helmet. When standing my noggin is above the boom, seated it will just whoosh over. Besides, before long I'll be sailing something with sprit booms and loose foots. What does catching a crash jibe with your noodle on a Core Sound do? Give you a nasty carpet burn?  I'm fine by Charlie's PFD philosophy, nothing to disagree with. I singlehand most of the time, so that's part of why I wear a PFD more often than not. There's another reason, too. I've found lake cops tend to leave me alone when I'm wearing a PFD - I call it my game warden repellent. ;D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lbrewer Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 Applause to you for making the call Ray. Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brigait1 Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 I know I'm preaching to the choir here, but just to make extra clear, no law can keep the real idiots out there safe from themselves. And to prove the point, observe the link below. Caution: While nobody appears to be seriously hurt, I wouldn't watch this if you're squeamish. Also, probably not appropriate for kids. http://www.break.com/index/idiot_shoots_self_with_flare_gun.html PeteB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillB Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 [quote author=Hirilond Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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